Help me pick my suspension!!
11-07-2011, 10:11 PM
#1
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Help me pick my suspension!! This project is LONG overdue, and when I do things, I only like to do them once and to do it right the first time. With that being said....please help me select my suspension.
I've got a 2000 T/A A4 2.73s with all stock suspension, with about 75k original miles. I need a setup for AutoX and highway racing (racing from a roll).
It will also be a HUGE PLUS if I can get the car to ride/handle like a Porsche (probably asking to much?)
Here is what I'm looking into so far:
-SHOCK TOWER BRACE (BMR) - installed a few days ago
-K-MEMBER (UMI) - road race version
-SUBFRAME CONNECTORS (UMI) - 3 point bolt in (will be welded as well)
-SPRINGS (STRANO) - picked up a NIB set from another member on here
-SWAY BARS (STRANO) -35/22mm hollow set
These other parts I have no clue about:
-TORQUE ARM
-SHOCKS
-CONTROL ARMS
-WATTS LINK/PHB
-RELOCATION BRACKETS
-SOLID MOTOR MOUNTS?
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER
What do you guys recommend?
I've got a 2000 T/A A4 2.73s with all stock suspension, with about 75k original miles. I need a setup for AutoX and highway racing (racing from a roll).
It will also be a HUGE PLUS if I can get the car to ride/handle like a Porsche (probably asking to much?)
Here is what I'm looking into so far:
-SHOCK TOWER BRACE (BMR) - installed a few days ago
-K-MEMBER (UMI) - road race version
-SUBFRAME CONNECTORS (UMI) - 3 point bolt in (will be welded as well)
-SPRINGS (STRANO) - picked up a NIB set from another member on here
-SWAY BARS (STRANO) -35/22mm hollow set
These other parts I have no clue about:
-TORQUE ARM
-SHOCKS
-CONTROL ARMS
-WATTS LINK/PHB
-RELOCATION BRACKETS
-SOLID MOTOR MOUNTS?
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER
What do you guys recommend?
Last edited by TruBloodTransAm; 11-17-2011 at 05:30 PM.
11-08-2011, 09:38 AM
#2
Ride and handle like a Porsche? You can really do one or the other, but you'll be as close as a solid axle, heavy car can get with a good set of parts. There are limits to the suspension design but the F-body can be made into a great handling machine. You'll just never match the functionality of an IRS but the F-Body can achieve some KILLER lateral grip and performs very well on road courses.
These other parts I have no clue about:
-TORQUE ARM - the factory torque arm is made from stamped sheet metal and the entire design and mounting setup is a terrible design. Not only does the torque arm come into play during acceleration, but it also receives a great deal of forces under braking and can actually bend and/or brake the mount. Running a tubular torque arm that is relocated is a very good upgrade.
-SHOCKS - When it comes to handling, Koni is the way to go! Not only will the car feel more encourageable in corners, it will still retain excellent dampening on the street. If budget is a concern, Bilstein HDs and Tokico shocks offer good alternatives, depending on taste.
-CONTROL ARMS - The factory control arms can be manipulated by hand if you detach one side, imagine what a 350+lb/ft of torque LS engine is doing to it. Not only does the design leave something to be desired, the rubber bushing on either end will rot out and increase the effects of wheel hop.
-WATTS LINK/PHB - Panhard bar rear suspension is certainly ideal in how it locates the rearend because it gives a solid axle the most natural and free range of travel. A panhard bar, like the cars come with, limits travel, and has several short comings over a watts link, namely the rearend being kicked to one side when it's compressed. When your car is lowered, you will need to shorten your PHB.
-RELOCATION BRACKETS - relocations are there to give you your control arm angle back. When you lower your car, the control arm angle can become positive - where it points toward the ground from the rearend. You realistically want a neutral or negative - more aggressive - angle to the control arms. They are a good cure for wheel hop, or reduced traction after lowering your car.
-SOLID MOTOR MOUNTS? - We never suggest them because it makes it more difficult to work on the car and remove the transmission. Prothane makes an excellent poly motor mount, that's that I have gone with and what I suggest.
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER - if your driveshaft were to fail, it would do one of two things: flap around in your transmission tunnel and cut a bunch of stuff, or break and fall to the ground and possibly dig into the surface and catapult the car into the air. So it's just a great thing to have, regardless of what you use the car for.
What do you guys recommend? I recommend you go with Konis, springs, sway bars, adjustable panhard, and a tubular TA that has been relocated off the transmission.
These other parts I have no clue about:
-TORQUE ARM - the factory torque arm is made from stamped sheet metal and the entire design and mounting setup is a terrible design. Not only does the torque arm come into play during acceleration, but it also receives a great deal of forces under braking and can actually bend and/or brake the mount. Running a tubular torque arm that is relocated is a very good upgrade.
-SHOCKS - When it comes to handling, Koni is the way to go! Not only will the car feel more encourageable in corners, it will still retain excellent dampening on the street. If budget is a concern, Bilstein HDs and Tokico shocks offer good alternatives, depending on taste.
-CONTROL ARMS - The factory control arms can be manipulated by hand if you detach one side, imagine what a 350+lb/ft of torque LS engine is doing to it. Not only does the design leave something to be desired, the rubber bushing on either end will rot out and increase the effects of wheel hop.
-WATTS LINK/PHB - Panhard bar rear suspension is certainly ideal in how it locates the rearend because it gives a solid axle the most natural and free range of travel. A panhard bar, like the cars come with, limits travel, and has several short comings over a watts link, namely the rearend being kicked to one side when it's compressed. When your car is lowered, you will need to shorten your PHB.
-RELOCATION BRACKETS - relocations are there to give you your control arm angle back. When you lower your car, the control arm angle can become positive - where it points toward the ground from the rearend. You realistically want a neutral or negative - more aggressive - angle to the control arms. They are a good cure for wheel hop, or reduced traction after lowering your car.
-SOLID MOTOR MOUNTS? - We never suggest them because it makes it more difficult to work on the car and remove the transmission. Prothane makes an excellent poly motor mount, that's that I have gone with and what I suggest.
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER - if your driveshaft were to fail, it would do one of two things: flap around in your transmission tunnel and cut a bunch of stuff, or break and fall to the ground and possibly dig into the surface and catapult the car into the air. So it's just a great thing to have, regardless of what you use the car for.
What do you guys recommend? I recommend you go with Konis, springs, sway bars, adjustable panhard, and a tubular TA that has been relocated off the transmission.
11-08-2011, 10:10 AM
#3
Hey Tru. Strano sells the full UMI line. I would order shocks from him as he can match the proper ones to his springs and bars. Relocation brackets aren't needed as you're probably ok with forward bite as-is. If you're daily driving I'd avoid solid motor mounts. If you're not planning on changing setups often, a single adjustable PHB is a great choice. With the UMI parts you have already, along with your Strano set-up I wouldn't be afraid to go Porsche hunting...
ramey
ramey
11-08-2011, 01:16 PM
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In order...
shocks n springs
Front n rear sway bars
Watts link
Don't worry about the shock tower thing....
If your still not happy (and you should be happy)
Do the SFC thing.
shocks n springs
Front n rear sway bars
Watts link
Don't worry about the shock tower thing....
If your still not happy (and you should be happy)
Do the SFC thing.
11-08-2011, 01:26 PM
#6
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275/40/17
Front: Yokohama S Drive 95% thread left
Rear: Yokohama AVS ES100 (discontinued I believe?) 40% thread left
The fronts are practically brand new. I was going to buy rears as well, but figured it would be a waste of money since I plan on eventually getting 11's out back.
Front: Yokohama S Drive 95% thread left
Rear: Yokohama AVS ES100 (discontinued I believe?) 40% thread left
The fronts are practically brand new. I was going to buy rears as well, but figured it would be a waste of money since I plan on eventually getting 11's out back.
11-08-2011, 01:34 PM
#7
Yes. They are what actually has to keep the car connected to the road.
Shocks are the most important suspension mod. Exacerbated by the fact that they are the weakest link the stock setup.
You put good tires and shocks on an otherwise stock car and you will be amazed at how much better it is.
Order in which I think you should prioritize suspension mods (as in budget for):
1. Shocks
2. Sway bars
3. Springs
4. Watts link
There is not a linear gap between these though. Shocks are much higher than the rest. The Watts also is nice, but it is more like something to further refine the setup rather than a cornerstone. In addition, you might find you need to rebalance the sways after you get it (depending on what you do for the roll center and what the springs and bars are that you chose). I have Konis, Strano bars, stock springs, and the Watts... I didn't want lowering springs or higher rate springs though.
And then you can throw money at the rest of the things that have much smaller benefit for a handling car. Of course if you have worn out bushings replace them. 1LE type bushings in stock LCAs are also a good replacement and improvement that doesn't break the bank.
Shocks are the most important suspension mod. Exacerbated by the fact that they are the weakest link the stock setup.
You put good tires and shocks on an otherwise stock car and you will be amazed at how much better it is.
Order in which I think you should prioritize suspension mods (as in budget for):
1. Shocks
2. Sway bars
3. Springs
4. Watts link
There is not a linear gap between these though. Shocks are much higher than the rest. The Watts also is nice, but it is more like something to further refine the setup rather than a cornerstone. In addition, you might find you need to rebalance the sways after you get it (depending on what you do for the roll center and what the springs and bars are that you chose). I have Konis, Strano bars, stock springs, and the Watts... I didn't want lowering springs or higher rate springs though.
And then you can throw money at the rest of the things that have much smaller benefit for a handling car. Of course if you have worn out bushings replace them. 1LE type bushings in stock LCAs are also a good replacement and improvement that doesn't break the bank.
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11-08-2011, 02:19 PM
#8
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275/40/17
Front: Yokohama S Drive 95% thread left
Rear: Yokohama AVS ES100 (discontinued I believe?) 40% thread left
The fronts are practically brand new. I was going to buy rears as well, but figured it would be a waste of money since I plan on eventually getting 11's out back.
Front: Yokohama S Drive 95% thread left
Rear: Yokohama AVS ES100 (discontinued I believe?) 40% thread left
The fronts are practically brand new. I was going to buy rears as well, but figured it would be a waste of money since I plan on eventually getting 11's out back.
Cool...I did the same thing. I ran my stock LE wheels then when it was time for tires is when I changed my set-up.
Having an 11 out back is cool, looks great and gives you hella grip but if your going to run a much smaller tire in front(stagger) expect some understeer issues as you'll have much more traction out back when pushing hard in the corners.
11-08-2011, 04:39 PM
#10
They are the parts the directly address the leading causes of wheelhop, yes. But a panhard rod and torque arm also can help the cause. When customers ask us about how to solve their wheel hop, LCA and/or relocations always seem to fix it.
11-08-2011, 05:09 PM
#11
Might I suggest you call?
Maybe I missed it, but one thing I didn't see was any mention of class you want to autocross in. You can run about anything you bring, but if you want to be competitive you need to pay attention to what you can and can't do in various classes.
There are things on your list that you seem sure of that will screw you in terms of building a competitive car, and things that just aren't necessary.
As for how well an F-body can handle. EXTREMELY, if you do it right. Pony-cars with bolt on suspension parts, can and do run as fast as C6 Grand Sport and Z06's a fair amount of the time, and considering the weight and suspension differences, I think that's pretty telling. And I speak from experience. I just sold my Camaro to another autocrosser (I'll link the video below), but I've also got a new Mustang, and a C6 Z06 to compare/contrast changes with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7BPf...layer_embedded
I do carry everything UMI makes. I do my own parts. I think I'm the best source for your wants, since I'm actually the one around here who not only does what you want to do, but also does it at more than local, **** around, level... and I do well. I've got the best winning record over the last decade of any other competitor. I win roughly 95% of all events I run, even Nationals. I've won 14 Championships since 2002, all in pony-cars, 5 in various F-bodies, the rest in Mustangs (sorry, it became a better car than the Gen 5 Camaro for my use).
Maybe I missed it, but one thing I didn't see was any mention of class you want to autocross in. You can run about anything you bring, but if you want to be competitive you need to pay attention to what you can and can't do in various classes.
There are things on your list that you seem sure of that will screw you in terms of building a competitive car, and things that just aren't necessary.
As for how well an F-body can handle. EXTREMELY, if you do it right. Pony-cars with bolt on suspension parts, can and do run as fast as C6 Grand Sport and Z06's a fair amount of the time, and considering the weight and suspension differences, I think that's pretty telling. And I speak from experience. I just sold my Camaro to another autocrosser (I'll link the video below), but I've also got a new Mustang, and a C6 Z06 to compare/contrast changes with.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7BPf...layer_embedded
I do carry everything UMI makes. I do my own parts. I think I'm the best source for your wants, since I'm actually the one around here who not only does what you want to do, but also does it at more than local, **** around, level... and I do well. I've got the best winning record over the last decade of any other competitor. I win roughly 95% of all events I run, even Nationals. I've won 14 Championships since 2002, all in pony-cars, 5 in various F-bodies, the rest in Mustangs (sorry, it became a better car than the Gen 5 Camaro for my use).
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
11-08-2011, 05:14 PM
#12
TECH Senior Member
This project is LONG overdue, and when I do things, I only like to do them once and to do it right the first time. With that being said....please help me select my suspension.
I've got a 2000 T/A A4 2.73s with all stock suspension, with about 75k original miles. I need a setup for AutoX and highway racing (racing from a roll).
It will also be a HUGE PLUS if I can get the car to ride/handle like a Porsche (probably asking to much?)
I've got a 2000 T/A A4 2.73s with all stock suspension, with about 75k original miles. I need a setup for AutoX and highway racing (racing from a roll).
It will also be a HUGE PLUS if I can get the car to ride/handle like a Porsche (probably asking to much?)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDxe1lHIxuE
(fast forward to 6:49 if you don't want to watch the whole thing)
This is Sam Strano driving his '01 Z28, pretty simple bolt-on car when you look at it, no hacking or cutting, and no chassis mods...
http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...fications.html
Here is what I'm looking into so far:
-SHOCK TOWER BRACE (UMI) - installed a few days ago
-K-MEMBER (UMI) - road race version
-SUBFRAME CONNECTORS (UMI) - 3 point bolt in (will be welded as well)
-SHOCK TOWER BRACE (UMI) - installed a few days ago
-K-MEMBER (UMI) - road race version
-SUBFRAME CONNECTORS (UMI) - 3 point bolt in (will be welded as well)
-SPRINGS (STRANO) - picked up a NIB set from another member on here
-SWAY BARS (STRANO) -35/22mm hollow set
-SWAY BARS (STRANO) -35/22mm hollow set
These other parts I have no clue about:
-TORQUE ARM
-CONTROL ARMS
-RELOCATION BRACKETS
-SOLID MOTOR MOUNTS?
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER
-TORQUE ARM
-CONTROL ARMS
-RELOCATION BRACKETS
-SOLID MOTOR MOUNTS?
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER
11-08-2011, 10:31 PM
#13
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Ride and handle like a Porsche? You can really do one or the other, but you'll be as close as a solid axle, heavy car can get with a good set of parts. There are limits to the suspension design but the F-body can be made into a great handling machine. You'll just never match the functionality of an IRS but the F-Body can achieve some KILLER lateral grip and performs very well on road courses.
These other parts I have no clue about:
-TORQUE ARM - the factory torque arm is made from stamped sheet metal and the entire design and mounting setup is a terrible design. Not only does the torque arm come into play during acceleration, but it also receives a great deal of forces under braking and can actually bend and/or brake the mount. Running a tubular torque arm that is relocated is a very good upgrade.
-TORQUE ARM - the factory torque arm is made from stamped sheet metal and the entire design and mounting setup is a terrible design. Not only does the torque arm come into play during acceleration, but it also receives a great deal of forces under braking and can actually bend and/or brake the mount. Running a tubular torque arm that is relocated is a very good upgrade.
-SHOCKS - When it comes to handling, Koni is the way to go! Not only will the car feel more encourageable in corners, it will still retain excellent dampening on the street. If budget is a concern, Bilstein HDs and Tokico shocks offer good alternatives, depending on taste.
-CONTROL ARMS - The factory control arms can be manipulated by hand if you detach one side, imagine what a 350+lb/ft of torque LS engine is doing to it. Not only does the design leave something to be desired, the rubber bushing on either end will rot out and increase the effects of wheel hop.
-WATTS LINK/PHB - Panhard bar rear suspension is certainly ideal in how it locates the rearend because it gives a solid axle the most natural and free range of travel. A panhard bar, like the cars come with, limits travel, and has several short comings over a watts link, namely the rearend being kicked to one side when it's compressed. When your car is lowered, you will need to shorten your PHB.
-RELOCATION BRACKETS - relocations are there to give you your control arm angle back. When you lower your car, the control arm angle can become positive - where it points toward the ground from the rearend. You realistically want a neutral or negative - more aggressive - angle to the control arms. They are a good cure for wheel hop, or reduced traction after lowering your car.
-DS SAFETY LOOPS/CROSS MEMBER - if your driveshaft were to fail, it would do one of two things: flap around in your transmission tunnel and cut a bunch of stuff, or break and fall to the ground and possibly dig into the surface and catapult the car into the air. So it's just a great thing to have, regardless of what you use the car for.
Last edited by TruBloodTransAm; 11-08-2011 at 10:36 PM.
11-09-2011, 09:51 AM
#15
My responses are in bold bellow. I hope this helps. Let me know if there is anything I can help you out with.
- Kevin
- Kevin
If I can get close to one or the other, I guess that's ok.
So the stock TA is mounted to the transmission right? The TA relocation kit will move it OFF the transmission. So I have to pull off my stock cross member and the relocation kit will bolt up in it's place? Like I said, I don't know crap about this stuff but there seems to be two TA's on the market, a long one and a shorty version. There's one that I saw that bolts up to the drive shaft loop as well...I'm already confused lol
Correct, it's a direct swap for the factory crossmember and, honestly, the way the cars should have come from the factory. Mounting a torque arm to the tailshaft of the transmission is a bonehead move, and I would love to say that right to the engineer's face, if I were to meet him. haha The shorter version will move your instant center back, while a longer factory replacement arm will retain the factory instant center. Moving the instant center back is better for drag racing because it decreases the tendency to lift the front of the car, but that hasn't stopped cars with our TA001 and relocation from going DEEP into the 9s and even 8-second elapsed times. It's also the same setup used on Project STi Killer for GM High Tech Performance and has proven itself more than up to the task of helping that SS navigate a road course.
Glad you mentioned the Koni's, I was leaning towards them. They seem to be the best of the best. Do I want single adjustable or double adjustable? Ideally, I'd like to just adjust them the one time when installed and not mess with them again. A lot of this tweaking is over my head.
Ideally, you want double, but that increased your buy-in for the suspension components. However, Koni did a great job in setting up their single adjustables and I honestly don't know of anyone who bought the singles and wish they got the doubles. I run double adjustable KW coilovers on my GTO and once I set them up, I haven't touched them. I wrote an article on how to set up double adjustable suspension for road racing, if you would like to look into it. It is indeed a tiring task, but it's fun to learn if you've never done it before. It just takes patience, and a full day at a track to make your adjustments one-by-one. That is if you're looking to get meticulous with it, and it sounds like you aren't. Thankfully, Koni's suggested, out of the box settings are pretty killer and you probably won't deviate to much from them.
Selecting control arms seems to be the MOST confusing aspect. So there are lower and upper control arms for the front and just lower control arms for the rear correct? There also seems to be relocation brackets for the rear lower control arms. What do I need to connect to my UMI 3 point subframe connectors? How do the rod ends compare to the polyurethane bushings?
Correct, the front uses an upper and lower control arm system. The factory front lower control arm is very heavy, and going to a tubular lower such as our design, will shave off 7lbs of unsprung weight and be more precise which will help the car's handling. The factory upper flexes around but there is no real weight savings to be had with our upper, just a better component. For our back, the rear lower control arms are what I was talking about with its flexible design. We offer several options, and the most popular seem to be the adjustable poly/poly and poly/rod. The adjustment allows you to center your rear in the wheel well, should you choose to upgrade to an aftermarket rear or a larger tire. Poly/poly is the best overall upgrade for a street car looking to increase NVH as little as possible. The poly/rod benefits from mounting the poly on the body to absorb some noise, and the rod end offers the precision people are looking for. The relocation might be a good item to look at if your control arm angle gets funky after you lower it. They will provide the car with a negative control arm angle, great for drag racing. You will need nothing special to have them work with the components you have on the car now.
As far as this goes, there are only two options either a panhard bar or the fay2watts link. Obviously there's a huge difference in price, but like I said, I only want to do this once and do it right the first time. Everyone who has the Watts link seems to love it, but do I really need this? The watts link seems like there are a lot of components to tweak on there, maybe this is for people who like to tinker with their stuff all the time. I really just want to install it, tweak it once and forget about it.
Nobody needs a Watts link because the panhard system on the car works. The Watts link is just a dramatic improvement over the limited design of the panhard system. As far as installation goes, we make one for the 1st and 2nd Gens and ours is very easy to set up. When I helped my friend install his Fays2 system on his Mustang, it also seemed very easy to install, so I don't think it's really all that hard to get it set in there right. You shouldn't have any trouble installing it and forgetting about it, should you choose to go down that path. I am concerned that the Fays2 website only shows it installed on a Dana60 and not a factory 10-bolt, which would have different size axle tubes and the rear diff sits in a different position. I'm sure they have a solution, should you email/call them. It is, however, $530 more expensive than our cheapest adjustable panhard bar.
I think I mentioned this already above with the control arms.
So the poly ones will absorb impact from the motor moving around, where as the solid ones will be harsher? What are the stock ones made of? I had the prothane motor mounts installed in November of 2008 by LMR in Houston. I assume they're still good right? Can I reuse these with an after market k-member?
Solid is very rough. Any...ANY movement in the motor is transfered into the chassis. The poly has some give to it, so it does absorb some but not all. The factory motor mounts are made from rubber and they do a fine job absorbing noise and vibrations from the motor, but it does so by allowing the motor to move around alot. I would just visually inspect them. They should be fine, but there is always a chance a crack has formed. Yes, you will be able to reuse them on our K-Memember.
This does seem like a good idea for peace of mind, even though the car is a daily driver. I mentioned above that there seems to be a TA that attaches to the DS loop. Is this configuration more beneficial to my goals?
It's always a good idea, I've broken a driveshaft and it was the worst. haha Anyway, if that is something you think you would like, then go with that. We don't offer one like that, but we could always work something out with our driveshaft safety loop if you called me up at the shop.
So the stock TA is mounted to the transmission right? The TA relocation kit will move it OFF the transmission. So I have to pull off my stock cross member and the relocation kit will bolt up in it's place? Like I said, I don't know crap about this stuff but there seems to be two TA's on the market, a long one and a shorty version. There's one that I saw that bolts up to the drive shaft loop as well...I'm already confused lol
Correct, it's a direct swap for the factory crossmember and, honestly, the way the cars should have come from the factory. Mounting a torque arm to the tailshaft of the transmission is a bonehead move, and I would love to say that right to the engineer's face, if I were to meet him. haha The shorter version will move your instant center back, while a longer factory replacement arm will retain the factory instant center. Moving the instant center back is better for drag racing because it decreases the tendency to lift the front of the car, but that hasn't stopped cars with our TA001 and relocation from going DEEP into the 9s and even 8-second elapsed times. It's also the same setup used on Project STi Killer for GM High Tech Performance and has proven itself more than up to the task of helping that SS navigate a road course.
Glad you mentioned the Koni's, I was leaning towards them. They seem to be the best of the best. Do I want single adjustable or double adjustable? Ideally, I'd like to just adjust them the one time when installed and not mess with them again. A lot of this tweaking is over my head.
Ideally, you want double, but that increased your buy-in for the suspension components. However, Koni did a great job in setting up their single adjustables and I honestly don't know of anyone who bought the singles and wish they got the doubles. I run double adjustable KW coilovers on my GTO and once I set them up, I haven't touched them. I wrote an article on how to set up double adjustable suspension for road racing, if you would like to look into it. It is indeed a tiring task, but it's fun to learn if you've never done it before. It just takes patience, and a full day at a track to make your adjustments one-by-one. That is if you're looking to get meticulous with it, and it sounds like you aren't. Thankfully, Koni's suggested, out of the box settings are pretty killer and you probably won't deviate to much from them.
Selecting control arms seems to be the MOST confusing aspect. So there are lower and upper control arms for the front and just lower control arms for the rear correct? There also seems to be relocation brackets for the rear lower control arms. What do I need to connect to my UMI 3 point subframe connectors? How do the rod ends compare to the polyurethane bushings?
Correct, the front uses an upper and lower control arm system. The factory front lower control arm is very heavy, and going to a tubular lower such as our design, will shave off 7lbs of unsprung weight and be more precise which will help the car's handling. The factory upper flexes around but there is no real weight savings to be had with our upper, just a better component. For our back, the rear lower control arms are what I was talking about with its flexible design. We offer several options, and the most popular seem to be the adjustable poly/poly and poly/rod. The adjustment allows you to center your rear in the wheel well, should you choose to upgrade to an aftermarket rear or a larger tire. Poly/poly is the best overall upgrade for a street car looking to increase NVH as little as possible. The poly/rod benefits from mounting the poly on the body to absorb some noise, and the rod end offers the precision people are looking for. The relocation might be a good item to look at if your control arm angle gets funky after you lower it. They will provide the car with a negative control arm angle, great for drag racing. You will need nothing special to have them work with the components you have on the car now.
As far as this goes, there are only two options either a panhard bar or the fay2watts link. Obviously there's a huge difference in price, but like I said, I only want to do this once and do it right the first time. Everyone who has the Watts link seems to love it, but do I really need this? The watts link seems like there are a lot of components to tweak on there, maybe this is for people who like to tinker with their stuff all the time. I really just want to install it, tweak it once and forget about it.
Nobody needs a Watts link because the panhard system on the car works. The Watts link is just a dramatic improvement over the limited design of the panhard system. As far as installation goes, we make one for the 1st and 2nd Gens and ours is very easy to set up. When I helped my friend install his Fays2 system on his Mustang, it also seemed very easy to install, so I don't think it's really all that hard to get it set in there right. You shouldn't have any trouble installing it and forgetting about it, should you choose to go down that path. I am concerned that the Fays2 website only shows it installed on a Dana60 and not a factory 10-bolt, which would have different size axle tubes and the rear diff sits in a different position. I'm sure they have a solution, should you email/call them. It is, however, $530 more expensive than our cheapest adjustable panhard bar.
I think I mentioned this already above with the control arms.
So the poly ones will absorb impact from the motor moving around, where as the solid ones will be harsher? What are the stock ones made of? I had the prothane motor mounts installed in November of 2008 by LMR in Houston. I assume they're still good right? Can I reuse these with an after market k-member?
Solid is very rough. Any...ANY movement in the motor is transfered into the chassis. The poly has some give to it, so it does absorb some but not all. The factory motor mounts are made from rubber and they do a fine job absorbing noise and vibrations from the motor, but it does so by allowing the motor to move around alot. I would just visually inspect them. They should be fine, but there is always a chance a crack has formed. Yes, you will be able to reuse them on our K-Memember.
This does seem like a good idea for peace of mind, even though the car is a daily driver. I mentioned above that there seems to be a TA that attaches to the DS loop. Is this configuration more beneficial to my goals?
It's always a good idea, I've broken a driveshaft and it was the worst. haha Anyway, if that is something you think you would like, then go with that. We don't offer one like that, but we could always work something out with our driveshaft safety loop if you called me up at the shop.
11-11-2011, 06:28 PM
#17
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Went ahead and ordered the following for now:
-Koni Sport Shock Set w/On-Car Single Adjustable Rears
-Strano 35/22mm Hollow Sway Bar Set
-Fays2 Watts Link
-Koni Sport Shock Set w/On-Car Single Adjustable Rears
-Strano 35/22mm Hollow Sway Bar Set
-Fays2 Watts Link
11-11-2011, 06:45 PM
#18
Q-
Nice conversation, and you had some great questions. Hope I got them all answered for you, but if not, you know where to find me.
Nice conversation, and you had some great questions. Hope I got them all answered for you, but if not, you know where to find me.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
11-14-2011, 10:21 AM
#19
The panhard rod length was fixed at the factory ride height. To really do it correctly, you should install an adjustable panhard bar when you lower a car so you can shorten it and bring the rearend back to center. In extreme cases, the factory panhard can make the car sit funky and the reared sit far off to one side.