robertbartsch

I assume these would be to replace the stock shocks; right/

I don't want a lowered ride so stock springs will stay. What is next?

1. bigger sway bars
2. LCA
3. Sub frame
4. Other???
5. New car?

wldesyWS6

iTrader: (2)

lol at new car. but ya, SFC for sure. forgot panhard bar too, and TQ arm i gues

hpjunky98

iTrader: (3)

Koni SAs
Strano Swaybars
Rod end PHB
Sticky Tires

coolformula

iTrader: (21)

My answer EXACTLY and thats what I GOT

And also the semi worthless STB lol.

mitchntx

iTrader: (14)

1. Driver training/seat time

DJ_951

3. Sub frame realy helped.

Furious_George

iTrader: (12)

i think my biggest improvements were SFCs and new shocks/struts. made it feel like an entirely different beast.

SpdFrk1990

iTrader: (6)

I did springs/shocks/lca's/phb at the same time and it was like a diff car.

whitedevil

iTrader: (9)

I didnt know how much a diff the STB made untill I took it off for a test drive when working on the car one day, It actually helps a bit.

After installing all the "rear" suspension stuff, that car felt way better.


LCA's
Sway Bars (ohh yeah)
TQ ARM
Wheels/Tires
Panhard rod
SUBFRAMES!
Strut Tower Brace

I got in my friends car, stock, and it felt like driving a big sponge on wheels compared to mine. I still dont have a TQ arm...

SpdFrk1990

iTrader: (6)

I still dont have a tq arm either with the relocation bracket and the poly bushing the stocker seems to work great. I dont go to the track either but it feels stout.

T-Punk

1. Good tires.
2. Shocks (Springs should also be changed. the lower CG and higher spring rates do wonders for handling)
3. Sways.
4. Adjustable PHB. (If you decided to lower the car)

SFC's aren't actually needed as much as everyone thinks. The reason most like them so much is that they get them early on before the suspension is set up properly and they help hide the symptoms of a poor suspension.

A torque arm can be nice but if handling is your thing don't get a short tunnel mounted style as that can lead to excessive brake hop. A full length torque arm that has it's front mounting point off the tranny (like UMI sells) is a great option. The decoupling arm from unbalanced engineering is an amazing piece but takes to work to get it set up properly in some cases.

LCA's need to be addressed as the stock bushings contribute to the inherent wheel hop problem these cars have. The stock arm's aren't as bad as everyone makes them out to be. Some moog bushings in the stock LCA's are usually all you need. If you want new LCA's though look for hard rubber or 3 piece poly if you drive on the street or rod ends if this is to be a designated track car.

lomaximumta

iTrader: (5)

I noticed a big difference from sub frame connectors.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

The driver doens't change the dynamics of body roll or lack of damping. While I agree that the driver a huge key to a race car, it's not part of "handling" per se when the car isn't being run at the absolute limit. And considering the way these cars don't even track well in a straight line, which the driver can't screw up, I'd focus on making the car more stable than telling folks they need to drive better. IMHO.

I will say that if he was racing and constantly going WAY too fast into turns and the car understeers... that would be a case of a driving F-ing up. And you don't tune a car like that.

shudog

iTrader: (3)

Werd. Going with the Koni SA up front allows you to use the lower spring perch giving you a 3/4" drop, then removing the rear rubber spring isolator evens it out. That slight drop along with the stiffer shocks made a night & day difference in the handling of my car. No real difference when I added the SFC's and PHB.

mitchntx

iTrader: (14)

Just to argue a bit ...

How can someone who doesn't really KNOW what "good handling" feels like make a good judgment call on what parts to get?

It wasn't until I was able to drive a dozen different cars across several platforms that I began to realize what was happening underneath the car, how changes affected "handling" and what changes were for the better.

Now, I will agree that some folks just want to install a bunch of "stuff" and pad their internet signature. They feel a "difference".

But different doesn't always equal better.

There are changes that folks make and claim better handling. Just read the previous hundred posts. The parts that made "the most difference" are all over the spectrum ... damping, roll control, chassis stiffness, increased dead weight on the nose ... each person claims nirvana.

I claim they feel a difference and not necessarily better.

So, I will stand by my "driver training" as the first real mod in order to better one's handling.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

So, even if you know nothing about driving, you can't tell the difference between a Town Car and an M5???????? I think not.

Further, I don't just accept statements like "I want my car to handle better" as the end. Actually, it's just the start, and I spend a LOT of time with folks to determine just what it is they'd like to change, since one's definition of most anything can and will vary from some other person's ideas.

Most folks, not all, but most know what they want to change about their car. It's a matter of digging that information out, which is what I do day in and day out. Not everyone can tell me anything useful and truly feel they don't want to change anything--those folks shouldn't be buying parts, and I tell them that since parts are meant to change things.....

mitchntx

iTrader: (14)

Of course people know the difference between a TC and M5. But I don't think a stock F-Car is comparable to either. Do you?

Why not go to a further, ludicrous extreme and say a Radio Flyer vs a Diablo. So come on ... keep it civil and reasonable

I DON'T think most folks really understand oversteer or understeer, what causes it and what it takes to address it. I keep seeing terms like body roll and stiffen my car as issues.

While you, Sam, are in the business of making folks happy and better know your ****, the other 50 or so "handling" gurus in this thread I'm not so sure about.

Further, you could sell 90% of the folks on here junk and as long as it "felt" different, you would be called "Da man" and they'd be happy.

Teach a man to fish and he can feed himself for life. Or you can spoon feed him and he be a burden for life.

Ericbigmac83

iTrader: (19)

Shocks, Sway bars, SFC's

BobDoLe

iTrader: (11)

lets see if i can tap my suspension modification experiences for some useful knowledge here...

i've modified the suspensions of my last 4 cars with all kinds of stuff: tires, shocks, springs, spring spacers, sway bars, poly bushings, strut tower braces, a-arm relocation kits and now with the fbody - lower control arms and panhard bar.
i can honestly say that very few products, if any, have made a total improvement. when you "upgrade" from factory, you end up (sometimes blindly) facing a tradeoff type of decision.

something as simple as a strut tower brace doesn't modify the original suspension design/geometry, but does add weight.
my swaybar "upgrade" is going to reduce body roll in corners, but it will also make the front end heavier, bring more understeer than i want, increase spring stiffness in ways that my bilstein shocks won't take kindly to - making the ride potentially more harsh than i can accept.

my lower control arms make the rear feel more solid in corners, but the poly bushings can bind and add squeaking noises.

my springs improved the look and various handling characteristics of my car. the also dropped the car a little too low and now my back hurts when the rear hits the bumpstops and i hold up traffic whenever there's a little bump in the road.

adjustments to suspension geometry through relocation or as a byproduct of lowering... i get headaches just remembering all the odd changes i had to get used to on each car; paying that extra bit of attention to make sure the car didn't wander after a lane change, dealing with understeer, etc. i remember seeing a sticker in a lowering springs box that warned of different handling characteristics. it spun the suspension geometry changes (again, byproducts) by suggesting that a skilled driver was needed to handle the car's "racing suspension."

luckily, guys like sam strano are around to engineer suspension packages with components that work with each other instead of against each other.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

Remember not all bar are really heavier, you just happen to have gotten one that is. More front bar does not necessarily bring more understeer. If that was the case I wouldn't run 35's on the front. There are many more variables than the basicaly thinking more bar = more push. Bars are not damped by the shocks, so while the wheel rate increases unlike springs you don't need more shock.