KILLERARMY

I found a 2002 Camaro SS (Sunset Orange) with only ( 21890) miles.This dealership is asking ($20950) and clear title on the ride. Do you consider this car way overprice for the amount of year of the car or what? How much should I you offer to the dealership for this Camaro SS. i also found another SS in FL with 20 something thousand miles and this dealership is asking ($20000). Are both this rides (Overprice) for years they have on them.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

Yes, I would consider that overpriced for the mileage, but I'm not surprised by the asking price. Dealers make all their profits on used cars, so they are always looking for top dollar. Last year, there was a 4k mile '02 SS M6 with every SLP option (including the "345HP Package") in better than excellent condition (possible #1 status) for $18,900, at a dealer no less, and that car sat for several months. I know that SOM brings a premium, but I wouldn't pay $21k for one with 20k+ miles. Something in the mid-teens would probably be proper, depending on options/condition/documentation.

Here is one with 35k miles for $14.5k, it's been for sale since mid-march:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/vehicle-c...o-ss-auto.html

JC316

iTrader: (1)

It went through Manheim Atlanta for $12,400 on April 5th. 02 Sunset Orange with 21,882. After fees and transport costs, they likely have 14K in the car, so their $21,000 is insane, I would say 17K is reasonable profit for them.

NC01TA

Excellent info!! I agree.
$20k is valid for a one or two owner garage queen with sub 10,000 miles but an auction car (with no history on top of it) is a mid teens price at best, even in SOM.
OP, you were smart in asking here. Don't pay too much.

Firebrian

SS's don't command WS6 money. For an SS to make it to the $20K level like a WS6 often does, it either needs to be unique, real rare, or absurdly low mileage. As a rule, SS's just aren't $20K cars.

I'd basically consider an 8K-12K mile 2002 SS M6 as a $15K-$16.5K car. They were selling for that 2 years ago. For 20K miles lop off another $1K. SOM premium would be 10-15% tops in my book. They don't have the near insatiable demand of the SOM WS6's. Fwiw 4 years ago I was considering buying a 2002 SOM SS vert A4 with 4K miles from a major dealer at $18,500. I'd have done a trade for my car it if not for the logistics involved in getting the cars to and from the midwest back to the east coast. That car started off being offered for $24K on line and languished for 6-8 months with a couple price drops along the way.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

I agree. That 4k mile SS I mentioned above was the nicest one I've seen in years, truly show quality of nearly the highest order, loaded with every desirable option imaginable (factory and SLP) except the CME (which is a plus to me, I hate the appearance of that setup), and it still took a while to sell at $18.9k at a dealer.

That SOM SS I linked above is only $14.5k at 35k miles, and nobody seems to be beating down any doors to buy it (though, it's a great looking car and I might consider it myself if it was closer to home). Dropping 15k miles off of that doesn't do a whole lot to increase value IMO, but if the other car is an M6 that would certainly ad a bit.

Seahawkfan

iTrader: (4)

I bought this a 01z28ss hardtop body has 7900 miles car has a built 416 , built 4l60e 12 bolt locker 4.10s spohn tubular everything , qa1 coil overs in front , wolfe chrome moly eight point 30k invested paid $19700 car is mint and has run 10.66 123mph car is worth every penny I paid

Z28tek

So true, the only ones I see command a lot of dough have less then 5K mileage, are an anniversary car, or a special edition like the Berger SS.

For an SS to make it to the $20K level like a WS6 often does,..[/QUOTE]

Excuse me did you say a WS6 commands near 20K?!
Ohh wait, they do!

Firebrian

Some WS6's can make $20K....the vast majority do not. It still takes very low miles and in most cases an M6 to get there....like 5K-10K miles on a 2001/2002. Exceptions would be anniversary cars in really nice condition or odd ball one offs like rare colors, SOM, 1LE's, etc. I recall 2 years ago a pair of 5K-9K mile 2001/2002 ILE's WS6 M6's bringing $23K-$24K on Ebay. At that time a 2001 NBM Firehawk A4 Vert with 12K miles made it to around $20,500. These are special cars.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

I agree. But to give some background on why that comment was posted, Z28tek is simply trying to drag a disagreement from another thread into this one. Your post above isn't what he was hoping to hear though...LOL.

Z28tek

Still sore about that? My apologies, I didn't mean to make you look bad or un-educated, it was not my intention.
I have the upmost respect for other posters.

What Firebrian said about a taken care of low mileage WS6's being worth 20K and special cars being rare/worth a lot if EXACTLY what I said, before you disagreed, but now you suddenly agree? That's called backpedaling.
I didn't even bring up cars like the Blackbird, Dale Earnhardt 'Intimidator' SS or Berger SS, which are SUPER rare and worth a ton of money.

http://www.superchevy.com/features/c...or-ss-camaros/

85: Dale Earnhardt Intimidator SS Camaros were built.
•1: '00 (prototype owned by Dale Jr. and the only one Dale Sr. ever drove).
•1: '01 prototype.
•83: '01 numbered cars.
•1: '02 (non-numbered, specially built for Kelley Earnhardt).
•33: Total silver-faced dashes were signed by Dale Sr.
•Car numbers with signed dashes: 1-12, 14-28, 46, 50, 52 and two prototypes. 32 signed in black ink and 1 signed in blue ink.
•38: T-tops.
•47: Coupes.
•Both prototypes were T-tops.
•Car Number 13 was held out per Dale Sr. being superstitious.
•Last car is number 83.
•30 deposits were taken before Dale Sr.'s death.
•400 requests were received the week after the accident.
•Intimidator SS #3 is owned by DEI and is believed to have less than 40 miles on the odometer.


Anyone remember this beast?! Super rare 4th gen!
http://www.superchevy.com/features/1...vrolet-camaro/



His post is exactly what I was saying and his statements almost mirror mine, dollar for dollar.


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RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

Don't worry, you haven't. So far, you've only managed to embarrass yourself.

Really?... Let's take a look:

...and here's what I wrote two days ago in the other thread:

Looks quite similar to me. Firebrian knows his stuff and certainly has my respect, so it's no surprise we'd make similar posts in different threads.

You seem to be deflecting again here, grouping your car in with those of lower mileage and greater desirability, and preaching dealer asking prices as gospel while shrugging off Ebay data.

I don't think I've seen anyone yet agree with the idea that a black '99 WS6 M6 with 44k miles and minor bolt-ons is absolutely a $20k car, nor that better deals on similar cars can't be found. After all, that's what I was originally debating with you. Everything else is just you trying to bait a different argument.

Z28tek

Cause its almost exactly what I said!
What the hell are you talking about?

Those cars.com links and autotrader links really tore you up didn't they?
Little upset you got caught dead wrong about their worth? I wasn't intentionally trying to make you look so clueless.
Those are reputable dealers that sell cars consistently, not some shady auction or ebay/craigslist deal and it's WAY more accurate then anything you have posted, and you don't want to admit it.

You can deny it and talk it down all you want, don't bother me any, and it certainly doesn't change anything.
Believe whatever you want to believe I guess and call it the truth.

I never said my car was absolutely a 20k car, thats a lie and poor twist of words to use in this debate.
My car with 15K would be a 20K car. A couple more years in storage and yes, it would be worth near that.

I did group it in because it's 20K miles from being worth 18-21K, as I have proven, and similar cars sell for 16-18K, and you have not countered with anything but an opinion, that's been proven wrong.

Go ahead and reply and argue, not really sure who you're arguing with at this point, it certainly isn't me, this is general knowledge for car guys that know their stuff. You obviously don't, and thats ok. I am just showing you what they sell for, you can bitch about it all you want, but you can't change it.

Atleast I am sticking to what I said and not backtracking. You will keep arguing because accepting the truth means you have to admit what I said about low mile WS6's and their vale, Anniversary cars and their value and rare 4th gens and their value.

I've quoted everything you've said, you can't go back on it.
You've learned some new information about some rare Fbodies and the true worth of a taken care of WS6 or Ann car, you should be happy. You should always be open to learning, because when it comes to what makes a car valuable, or a possible collector, your clueless, and not based on what I have said to you, based on some of the things you have stated, and now your embarrassed.



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RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

What am *I* talking about? LOL. What are YOU talking about!? I wrote nearly the same thing two days ago, quoted and linked there for you to see with your own eyes. Here it is again, so you don't even have to scroll back up to find it:

Oops. Looks like you put your foot in your mouth again. Sorry you missed it before, but if you'd slow down a bit and absorb what you read, you would have caught this days ago rather than making such a foolish remark today.

I wasn't debating the value of cars which are much more collectible/desirable than yours, only the claims you made about your car.

That's good, because you've not succeeded at all. I'm sorry I upset you with that Ebay car so closely comparable to yours which sold for $13,700. I'm sure some have done and will do better, so don't be too upset.

Asking prices don't necessarily reflect actual sales value. Or maybe you don't ever negotiate with dealers? If you're paying full price, allow me to offer you some advice: you can make lower offers, sometimes they'll even get accepted. You can thank me later for the money that this information may save you in the future.

No, you're just trying to have the argument that you WANT to have and I refuse to take the bait.

You said:

...and:

[side note: black was not even an available interior color in 1999. Your interior is dark gray (RPO 142, or 143 without the AQ9 seats). But, expert that you are, I'm sure you already know this and likely were just testing me...lol]

To which I responded:

You then asserted:

So, to recap, you've received offers over $20k, and you would want near $20k to sell, and you know what your car is worth. Just to be clear, this is where the $20k figure came from, and that's what we've (or at least *I've*) been debating. All those other cars with half (or less) the mileage, more desirable model years, various special editions, SOM cars, etc., have nothing to do with this.

As for twisting of words, you still haven't explained where you came up with this gem:

I didn't say that at all. I'm not even sure what I might have said that would lead you to such a misunderstanding.

Yes, if your car had half the miles it might qualify for that group. But it doesn't, so why would you include it?

That's more realistic for yours, too bad you didn't start with that number and avoid all this non-sense and comparisons to cars with half the mileage or less.

Nobody else, just you.

Really? So how'd we get from "I'd want near 20K" and "I know what my cars worth" to "similar cars sell for 16-18K". Oops again.

And how about this:

So clearly you were just teasing here then?

Too late. I already said the same thing TWO DAYS ago. I just don't see how your car fits that same mold, or should be grouped with some of the listings you've posted (plus you dismiss Ebay, so I guess we'll have to scrap any data from there...easy enough to just ignore the stuff you don't like I guess).

Great, because I don't need to go back on anything.

If only you could take your own advice. If only...

I've already done you the favor of providing some useful information regarding optional content and cleared up some of your misunderstandings about your own car. Hopefully you're able to capitalize on this new information by engaging in higher levels of conversation when discussing these cars with others in the future.

And just to be clear, I don't normally speak to members this way, but your posts have devolved to an egregious level and earned you some special attention. This isn't much of a surprise though, based on the immediate boasting you opened with in that other thread:

...and the air of superiority just continued with pretentious comments such as:

...some of which are not only brash (especially telling another member that his car was "not worth anything" simply because it had an upgraded rear), but also based on the fallacy of grouping your car in with examples of much greater collector desirability.

Z28tek

You have made it quite obvious what you know about what makes a car a collectible.
I have proven what I stated about certain cars worth, you have proven nothing.

I shouldn't have poked fun about your incorrect statements and lack of knowledge about the worth of a low mileage WS6 and other cars I mentioned, I apologize.

Lol! Those cars are identical to mine, with a little more miles! Ahahahaha.
Modifying a collector car or a car that might be considered one, like a brand new no mile Firehawk, makes it plummet in value, this is basic car knowledge.
Learn, listen and move forward.
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GimmeLSx

iTrader: (4)

This thread is amusing. It reminds me of an old saying: "Never argue with an idiot. He will bring you down to his level and beat you with experience."

Z28tek

Nice first post. What a mystery!
Hahahaha.

GimmeLSx

iTrader: (4)

Au contraire; sorry to burst your bubble, but I have been posting here since 2012.

Z28tek

Ohh your post count on the side says 1, I was going off that.
I rarely post on here but check in on time to time to take in more information, this is a great place to learn.

I'll be getting some pics of my cars soon and posting them, been awhile.

AnotherWs6

iTrader: (17)

YUP.

And hey arguing z28 guy, you've received 20K offers at shows?........... No you haven't.

Never seen RPM get so worked up.