Raptor camshaft from Thunder Racing.....who has info on it
01-11-2009, 05:44 AM
#1
Raptor camshaft from Thunder Racing.....who has info on it Anyone else heard of this cam? I called TR up about 2 months ago, and they told me that it would be a perfect match for my cam only setup. They claim that it makes more torque than the T-Rex, and is also the current record holder in Australia for the cam only setup. So has anyone tried this cam, or know someone that has more information about it? Anything will help guys.
Specs: TR Raptor- 236/242 615/615 111+2 lsa
Specs: TR Raptor- 236/242 615/615 111+2 lsa
01-16-2009, 08:36 AM
#7
i would assume you have an ATI/FTI 5500 converter or something similar? i assume you are ready to turn to 7000 rpms mimimum? i assume you have et drags/hoosiers/m/t radials?
the way you quickly dismissed my point, i would readdress these issues. big cam doesnt mean faster car.
the way you quickly dismissed my point, i would readdress these issues. big cam doesnt mean faster car.
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01-16-2009, 12:13 PM
#8
I told them my setup to the T. Yank 4000 stall, 4L60E w/brake, 12 bolt 3.90 gears, slick, stock bottom end motor....ect. They said it was a great match. So if it required for me to have a 5500 RPM stall, and spin to 7K, why would they recommend me that camshaft?
01-16-2009, 01:51 PM
#10
I have come across VERY few people who took the time to really look at a set up and give advise appropriate to the situation. Also please mind that not all people are accurate with their vehicle's expectation and cam guru's can go only off what is given.
01-16-2009, 02:17 PM
#11
Honestly if you are looking for a max effort/closse to max effort setup, you're in deep doo doo with a 4ljunkie tranny right from the get go, the planataries in that thing aren't gonna like you turning them to 7 grand.
That cam, is probably gonna want to make power to 7 grand in a stock ci motor, that being said, your converter/gearing, unless the car is 2800 lsb are probably not optimal becuase you're not gonna see that kind of rpm at say a 3300 raceweight (I'm guessing here please bear with me)
It's gonna take a while to get into the powerband and with your gearing and converter the shifts are probably gonna drop the rpm back out of the range enough so that it's not gonna be as fast as it could be.
You definately need more converter, get at least a 4600 to 5000 in there, the 5500 one that alot of the fast cam only cars ran would be great too.
Gearing, unless the car is really light I'd put 4.30's in it if you want it to run as good as you can.
I'd also look at dumping the 4ljunkie becuase of the planatary issues that you'll eventually have at that rpm and put a th400 or th350 at least in it. Biggest thing that worry I have with 7000 rpm and a 4ljunkie, if that there's no tranny shields made for htat thing, and if it lets go you coudl have frag coming thru the floor, which is like a grenade going off. The kind of rpm that you need to turn and that tranny are not a good combo, and with no shield you're asking to get hurt. Plus the performance isn't gonna be there compared to what you would have with a race tranny anyway, regardless if you put a transbrake in it or whatever. Plus, the reliability, is never gonna be there regardless what anyone says.
Depending on what you're willing to do and what the car weigh's, there are probably alot of cams out there that would work out better, there are guys that have made it into the 10's with cam only setups that weren't spinning them past 6800, there was a thread in here not too long ago I can't remember the guy's screen name, but he was running something in the 230/230 range, and I think he was shifting at 6800 if I remember correctly.
That cam, is probably gonna want to make power to 7 grand in a stock ci motor, that being said, your converter/gearing, unless the car is 2800 lsb are probably not optimal becuase you're not gonna see that kind of rpm at say a 3300 raceweight (I'm guessing here please bear with me)
It's gonna take a while to get into the powerband and with your gearing and converter the shifts are probably gonna drop the rpm back out of the range enough so that it's not gonna be as fast as it could be.
You definately need more converter, get at least a 4600 to 5000 in there, the 5500 one that alot of the fast cam only cars ran would be great too.
Gearing, unless the car is really light I'd put 4.30's in it if you want it to run as good as you can.
I'd also look at dumping the 4ljunkie becuase of the planatary issues that you'll eventually have at that rpm and put a th400 or th350 at least in it. Biggest thing that worry I have with 7000 rpm and a 4ljunkie, if that there's no tranny shields made for htat thing, and if it lets go you coudl have frag coming thru the floor, which is like a grenade going off. The kind of rpm that you need to turn and that tranny are not a good combo, and with no shield you're asking to get hurt. Plus the performance isn't gonna be there compared to what you would have with a race tranny anyway, regardless if you put a transbrake in it or whatever. Plus, the reliability, is never gonna be there regardless what anyone says.
Depending on what you're willing to do and what the car weigh's, there are probably alot of cams out there that would work out better, there are guys that have made it into the 10's with cam only setups that weren't spinning them past 6800, there was a thread in here not too long ago I can't remember the guy's screen name, but he was running something in the 230/230 range, and I think he was shifting at 6800 if I remember correctly.
01-16-2009, 02:51 PM
#12
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A parts slinger's job is to sell parts.
I have come across VERY few people who took the time to really look at a set up and give advise appropriate to the situation. Also please mind that not all people are accurate with their vehicle's expectation and cam guru's can go only off what is given.
I have come across VERY few people who took the time to really look at a set up and give advise appropriate to the situation. Also please mind that not all people are accurate with their vehicle's expectation and cam guru's can go only off what is given.
The Raptor cam WILL work fine with a 4000+ converter. I do have customers here and abroad running that cam with 4000 to 4400 converters with much success. We have one customer with a GTO at 3550 race weight running 11.0 @ 122 with a PTC 4000 converter and 4.10 gears CAM ONLY.
Not trying to be overly sensitive or anything but we do take alot of pride in what we do here. One thing you will find out about Thunder Racing is that we are always honest with our customers and try our best to manage expectations. We don't sell parts that won't work and we try our best give our customers what they need to go fast.
Sorry for the rant...
Thanks,
Shane
01-16-2009, 03:33 PM
#13
Shane's 100% right on a couple things, thunder ragins are pretty stand up people, better then alot of the people out there that I, and others I know have dealt with. I think you guys went thru some personnel changes, but I understand that things are back on the up and up there now. The other thing that you're absolutely right on, is people's expectations. They see that a car like the GTO you mentioned runs those #"s and they expect the same results. I'm sure that you are all too informed that every car that gets a trex doesn't go out and run 10.50 or better, but people think that because they bought that cam and one guy went 10.32 with it cam only that they can run mid to bottom 10's now.
I can just imagine the phone call... "what to you mean, just because my car is 3700 lbs and I only have 3.73's and nitto's on my stock suspension (stock meaning the stock control arms, tq arm, shocks etc) doesn't mean that it shouldn't be running mid 10's, come on smokin01 did it
I can just imagine the phone call... "what to you mean, just because my car is 3700 lbs and I only have 3.73's and nitto's on my stock suspension (stock meaning the stock control arms, tq arm, shocks etc) doesn't mean that it shouldn't be running mid 10's, come on smokin01 did it
01-16-2009, 04:00 PM
#15
When people say a lot of stall they are talking like 4500 and up, for the gearing they are talking at least a 4.10.
People ditch the 4L junk for TH-350/400's for a reason.
To many people think a big cam makes more powerwhen in reality it better to go with to small of a cam then to big of one.
Tunder is top notch, my old car had quite a few bolt-ons from them BUT, I HATE off the shelf cams, I am all about custom grinds. People say that a cam needs a lot of stall, well I want a cam that needs X stall speed stall not X-X, this RPM intake, this gear, ect ect.
Ill never ever run a off the shelf aftermarket cam. Plenty of big name guys out there will get you a killer custom grind for $500 and less.
Look at what happend when the Trex first came out or the LT1 GM 847 cam, people got them and realized they did not want to spin their motor high enough to get it to peak power so what the point?
My old .060 over 454 had a old sollid flat tappet bottom 6.XXX lift cam and at at least 3,500 pounds with pretty much stock suspension and not so sticky tires it went 11.1 on the motor, old parts, an old carb, old heads and intake, ect ect.
That raptor is roughly the same size as mine was and my car loved it but was still rather nasty on the street and not something I drove a ton. I also shirted it at 7,000, cam needed a little more compression (12+).
Like JL said, just because somone ran X time with the cam does not mean you will off the trailer.
Lots of time in tuning, suspension and suspension tuning.
If I was going to go that sick of a cam in that size of a motor I would at the very least tear the motor down and make sure its ballanced pretty much perfect and give it a refresh.
At what RPM's though?
People ditch the 4L junk for TH-350/400's for a reason.
To many people think a big cam makes more powerwhen in reality it better to go with to small of a cam then to big of one.
Tunder is top notch, my old car had quite a few bolt-ons from them BUT, I HATE off the shelf cams, I am all about custom grinds. People say that a cam needs a lot of stall, well I want a cam that needs X stall speed stall not X-X, this RPM intake, this gear, ect ect.
Ill never ever run a off the shelf aftermarket cam. Plenty of big name guys out there will get you a killer custom grind for $500 and less.
Look at what happend when the Trex first came out or the LT1 GM 847 cam, people got them and realized they did not want to spin their motor high enough to get it to peak power so what the point?
My old .060 over 454 had a old sollid flat tappet bottom 6.XXX lift cam and at at least 3,500 pounds with pretty much stock suspension and not so sticky tires it went 11.1 on the motor, old parts, an old carb, old heads and intake, ect ect.
That raptor is roughly the same size as mine was and my car loved it but was still rather nasty on the street and not something I drove a ton. I also shirted it at 7,000, cam needed a little more compression (12+).
Like JL said, just because somone ran X time with the cam does not mean you will off the trailer.
Lots of time in tuning, suspension and suspension tuning.
If I was going to go that sick of a cam in that size of a motor I would at the very least tear the motor down and make sure its ballanced pretty much perfect and give it a refresh.
At what RPM's though?
01-16-2009, 05:19 PM
#16
Lots of good info here that i didn't know guys, i appreciate it. Yea i don't want to spin higher than 6800. My car will be light, in the 3100-3150 race weight range. Ok so maybe the T-Rex, or Raptor cam isn't what i am looking for. My current cam is a TR224. TS6 recommended I just keep it this season. Would i be better off just keeping that cam? And maybe shooting a dry shot to get the numbers im looking for?
01-17-2009, 04:06 PM
#18
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Shane's 100% right on a couple things, thunder ragins are pretty stand up people, better then alot of the people out there that I, and others I know have dealt with. I think you guys went thru some personnel changes, but I understand that things are back on the up and up there now. The other thing that you're absolutely right on, is people's expectations. They see that a car like the GTO you mentioned runs those #"s and they expect the same results. I'm sure that you are all too informed that every car that gets a trex doesn't go out and run 10.50 or better, but people think that because they bought that cam and one guy went 10.32 with it cam only that they can run mid to bottom 10's now.
I can just imagine the phone call... "what to you mean, just because my
car is 3700 lbs and I only have 3.73's and nitto's on my stock suspension (stock meaning the stock control arms, tq arm, shocks etc) doesn't mean that it shouldn't be running mid 10's, come on smokin01 did it
I can just imagine the phone call... "what to you mean, just because my
car is 3700 lbs and I only have 3.73's and nitto's on my stock suspension (stock meaning the stock control arms, tq arm, shocks etc) doesn't mean that it shouldn't be running mid 10's, come on smokin01 did it
On another note, you are right, we have gone through a TON of changes recently. I want to personally thank all of our past and current customers for sticking with us through it all. We are loving our new building and if you take the time to give us a call, you'll find nothing but a group of people who love what they do. Angie as Co-owner of the company has been around the longest, since our inception in Oct 1995. I have been around since '99 first as a customer, then as a part time employee, then shop manager, and now part owner. Gene is our Sales Manager and has been here almost a year now. He has been my best friend for nearly 20 years and I can surely vouch for his integrity. He has been involved in this hobby now for at least 17 years and has really come up to speed in the LS market very quickly. We also have Donald, Jeffery, Kris, Richard, and Sylvia all friends and family who are committed to the success of our customers and therefore Thunder Racing.
I would like everyone to keep in mind, there ARE companies out here who are not only interested in making the sale at all costs. Sure we are here to make a living and feed our families but not at the cost of our honesty and integrity. I guarantee when you get advice from one of us, it will be as accurate as our experience has shown and if we don't know the answer we'll let you know that as well. There have been many occasions where I have sent a customer to Madman or LMR or whomever I felt could better serve their needs. We're not here to have every last customer but the ones we do have WILL be taken care of to the best of our abilities.
Thanks,
Shane
01-17-2009, 04:59 PM
#19
Depending on what you're willing to do and what the car weigh's, there are probably alot of cams out there that would work out better, there are guys that have made it into the 10's with cam only setups that weren't spinning them past 6800, there was a thread in here not too long ago I can't remember the guy's screen name, but he was running something in the 230/230 range, and I think he was shifting at 6800 if I remember correctly.
...remember my car is a beast and i have kept alot of attention to detail, top notch parts that work well together
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...1-38-60ft.html
stand out points...60ft times, stock 3.23 10 bolt, stock 4l60e with ss4000, ls6 intake, 3275 raceweight, -400 DA...
you dont need a huge cam to run good numbers...but if you are going for the top of the list be willing to get everything big, gears, stall, cam, and have a tin can...
01-17-2009, 05:08 PM
#20
This was the cam in my little 468 BBC
http://cranecams.org/?show=browsePar...tNumber=131311
At least 3500 pounds, not very good stickes and pretty much stock rear suspension wnet 11.1 on the motor with old parts and old heads. Also needed more compression.
http://cranecams.org/?show=browsePar...tNumber=131311
At least 3500 pounds, not very good stickes and pretty much stock rear suspension wnet 11.1 on the motor with old parts and old heads. Also needed more compression.