I have not seen anything documented from a rebuilder. Joe Blows Performance can say all he wants but till a person with the exp looks at it his word does not mean anything. If APS is found at fault then yall should be taken care of. However I don’t think that will happen because of the 3 month warranty issue.

 

Calling them again now and I will update you guys as soon as I hear from them...

 

I thnk some of the problems with aps turbos are not the turbos. Oil smoking is hardly ever the turbos. It can caused by many things some guys are running high boost on stock motors so its likely blown engine . Agressive driving might also cause some smoking with the gravity feed setup. Overfilling of oil another possible,inlet tubes sucking shut could cause some smoking ..this one is aps fault for not making proper inlet tubes..easy fix with stents but still they should send stent kits or upgraded inlets free to original buyers of the collapsing stents.
Excessive crankcase pressure another thing that can cause smoking.
But turbos with bearing damage or poor balancing ,bearing damage from oil starvation and just low grade parts and they aren't many parts in a turbo can still give some problems and some of this seems to be happening with the aps turbos. I have still not seen direct to mits comparisons to show these are beyond a doubt knock offs.
Louis has for whatever reason maybe cause he was steal dealing with aps for kits not really shown us exactly how these are knockoffs or what was going.He did say think that running them at higher boost would kill them easier. They are a bit small for bigger than 346 engines but the factories regularly put mits and other smaller than optimal turbos on engines and no real ill effects. I have seen genuine mits "overspun" a lot to crazy boost levels and still survive a long time.Just too small effect is top end drops off but you get quicker spool up which is usually why factory undersizes.

90 day warranty is too short but is standard turbo warranty. But genuine mits turbos shouldn't hardly ever need a warranty.

I thnk have a 14b around here that can compare to but don't have a 20g lying around.
But would think any of these big turbo shops can dissect an aps and figure out if they are knock offs and show the differences and also show why they failed. I was originally thinking bad balancing. That can make a turbo destruct for sure. Fact turbo rebuild kits are super simple to install but you are supposed to rebalance them and that takes a good shop. There is next to nothing in a turbo if you look on ebay at rebuild kits.
Some wheels, shaft, etc. Very simple devices and very reliable if quality parts are used.

All that said I now believe aps are selling knock off turbos and pretty sure intentionally.
If it was unintentional Peter should have manned up, admitted it and offered to send genuine mits center sections free to people that have the knock offs. And there should be ways to see right away if they were knock offs hopefully but again no idea how close to the genuine article the knock offs look. Maybe you can't tell. ..until they self destruct.

I am paranoid to run mine past 8psi now. I have ebay replacement centers which might be good. One guy on forum has been running them and no problems last time we talked.
I would throw them in if the aps died in next week or two .Otherwise will likely resell them and get upgraded ones from LG or wherever ,from a place that can trust to sell genuine quality parts.

I have zero trust in APS anymore. Sad as they really looked like class act but Peter is actiing more like class clown these days.

 

I've read the first couple pages and the last couple posts of this thread.

Did you guys honestly expect to get anything else but cheap turbos/components with this kit? **** the complete kit is like $6000, that price doesn't leave any room to include nice components. You get what you pay for!

 

ROTFLMFAO to the third power... Now my face hurts...

 

You really didnt read this thread did you? He stated ALL American V8 kits would be stopping production. Vettes, GTO, Fbody, all of us.

If your dumb enough to send these snakes even more money, I turely feel sorry for you.

 

Jamar,

I just talked to Jose at Forced Inductions and he told me to ask you if you would mind if he could post of the results of the turbo inspection. If so do you mind giving him a call or sending him an email letting him know that you are ok with it.



Now on to the scary part after talking to Jose, I'm somewhat disgusted. He has made it very apparent that building large cubic inch motors for these kits will absolutely cause premature failure. Basically, the bearings are failing and causing oil gaskets to fail because of to much pressure. The smaller the cubic inch the more likely you are to make the turbos live. So the forged 418 is out of the question for me. And the other problem is that there isn’t really a direct replacement turbo for the kit because everything is proprietary but he did say that he would check and let us know when he finds out something.
So what are the main issues that we need to address:
1) Exhaust manifold flange should have been a T3 and there isn’t a good reliable way to fix that which limits turbo options substantially.
2) Our turbos have internal waste gates and there aren’t many turbo options out there that have internal waste gates
3) The down pipe is proprietary to the 20g but that wouldn’t be that hard to change just cut off one flange and weld on another one.
4) If we were to find a turbo to fit it would probably be one with an external waste gate and where would you mount it?

Damn what a mess… And once again, thanks Jose for taking time out of your busy schedule to answer questions.

 

From what I have researched, to have a manifold copied or designed from the Chinese manufacturer it is approximately $55 (for a 3cyl manifold) minimum quantity of 100 pieces. So for a V8 manifold, I am guessing around $75 (for a 4cyl manifold). Of course you would need both sides so you would have enough manifolds for 100 kits and each manifold kit would be approximately $150.

 

Mike,

I need a solution to the problem man and I'm just trying to find one. If I stopped dealing with everyone that gave me shitty service or that pissed me off hell I wouldn't deal with anyone. If you can give me a solution to the problem I would be more than happy to send you the money. All I'm saying is I have heard all the issues with Peter but the fact still stands that we need a solution to the problem and there really isn't an affordable one, as of yet... Unless you have one that you aren't sharing with the rest of us, and if that's the case I truly feel sorry for you. Otherwise, stop complaining and help find a solution to the problem.

 

You really don't want to copy the manifold. It needs a T3 flange on it instead of the T2 so it needs to be modified a little which would cause the mold to change...

 

I wasn't looking to copy it, I am looking at producing a 3cyl manifold, but figured pricing would be similar. They said they can make the manifold off of a sample or drawing (that kind of scares me).

 

LOL... And it should...

 

[QUOTE=DaGreightOne;12124567]Jamar,

I just talked to Jose at Forced Inductions and he told me to ask you if you would mind if he could post of the results of the turbo inspection. If so do you mind giving him a call or sending him an email letting him know that you are ok with it.

DONE! He has the turbos already ( they got there real fast) and has my premission to share info with the board. as soon as he has time we should be hearing something from him.

 

For those that have the kit with blown turbos Send the failed turbo to Forced Performance. They do alot of modifications and upgrades to Mitsubishi turbos.

http://store.forcedperformance.net/m...=Turbo-Rebuild

I posted about it on the ls1gto site- http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthr...91#post5975291

 

Peter just want to see if he can scam more, if it sounds to good to be true then its not, saddly.

 

This is your first hint your gonna recieve another **** Chinese turbo if the deal goes down.



Seems like alot for a no name chinese built turbo....


Oh, thank goodness no more of your trash floating around.


There, saved some of you who dont read the complete thread some time.
First he mentions a replacement, then pricing & then it's discontinued all in one page worth of him posting. Sounds like someone I want to send money to, LOL.



Wait, I thought all these were outta production & the fbody kit has been outta production for 8 months. Yet all these kits are still listed on their site, even after Peter sayin he was taking the fbody kit off there, which aslo hasnt happened.
http://www.airpowersystems.com/products_usa.html

 

for the results of what Jose has to say. Could be either really good news or really bad news.

 

I remember about 2 years ago now id say hearing pretty much this same thing on corvette forum. looks like ill have to post up on import sites for them to stay away from aps since the "muscle car" owners figured their bs out they stopped making kits for them. They will learn one day when they are bankrupt

 

Way to go APS!!! WTF. Oh well, I was trying to figure out how to get twins for my GTO. Guess I'll have to design and build my own or go with a Procharger. But I won't be home for 2+yrs so who knows who else will come and go. The more I learn about all of this, the more I want to build it myself. Hell these maggots learned all this stuff...anyone can. Do it yourself.

 

Hey Jammer, it's Joe P.- long time, no talk. While I hear what you are saying and do agree, I also feel it is wrong for them to just leave their customers high and dry like they do. Personally, if I had the system, I would just repair/replace the turbos and be done with it. Sure, I'd be upset, but life goes on. The problem is every group APS has been involved with, they have done the same thing with- come on the boards acting like your best friend announcing a new product. Promise the world as far as support, quality and replacement parts, then bail after their "introductory special" is over and problems start to arise. It's a real shame as the kit itself is an awesome street car setup.

I had their kit on my GTO- it made awesome power and was an exceptionally clean looking setup, but as people started to notice it wouldn't support the claimed power levels, the intakes were too small in diameter, hoses started collapsing, etc. they gave us the same complimentary reach around you guys got to make us feel loved, and then hit the door while we were still basking in the afterglow.

For some of us, that is not a problem, we will just roll with it and replace/fab what is needed- for the price of the kit, it is still worth it- but for others who rely on a top notch product, they were left screwed .