Supercharger vs Turbo.... OFFICIAL ARGUMENT THREAD.
04-16-2016, 05:52 AM
#101
I've mentioned a few times why a procharger was a better choice for me than a turbo. I wanted to leave my engine bay alone, didn't want to relocate or remove the a/c, sway bar, alternator, radiator, battery etc, but still make north of 700hp.
I'm not a welder, don't own a tig, so that meant paying for a kit or to have someone fab it for me.
I also like the fact that the power delivery is very linear and the throttle response is instant and predictable. I'm not saying that with a turbo it can't be, but I like how the procharger drives.
I'm also a 6-speed, will always be, have no interest in an automatic, so people talked me out of doing a turbo for that reason as well.
So for me, when I was choosing an FI path 4+ years ago, what I wanted and desired, influenced me to go with a procharger.
It's essentially a bolt on, couple weekend project, and you can have trouble free double the power. I put my setup together piece by piece, so I saved money by buying just what I needed, one piece at a time. I was able to buy a freshly serviced D1 that I was able to call procharger, and get confirmation of when it was put into service, and when the last service was done to it, for less than $2000.
Again, it's about what you want, what you can afford, what your skills are, and if you prefer building your car or driving your car.
For everyone saying turbos are easy, just browse this section and look at how many turbo help threads there are compared to blowers. Sure, there are more turbo setups, but the problems with them are there as well. A blower isn't as picky about camshaft selection, and exhaust setup as a turbo is.
With a procharger, you don't have to worry about breaking welds, how to route oil feed and return lines (just search how many threads are on that subject alone), camshaft selection, motor size, exhaust size going to the turbo, exhaust size out of the turbo.
Turbos are great, I have one on my daily driver 4-cylinder, but unless you have someone with experience with them, I wouldn't recommend it for a novice.
I'm not a welder, don't own a tig, so that meant paying for a kit or to have someone fab it for me.
I also like the fact that the power delivery is very linear and the throttle response is instant and predictable. I'm not saying that with a turbo it can't be, but I like how the procharger drives.
I'm also a 6-speed, will always be, have no interest in an automatic, so people talked me out of doing a turbo for that reason as well.
So for me, when I was choosing an FI path 4+ years ago, what I wanted and desired, influenced me to go with a procharger.
It's essentially a bolt on, couple weekend project, and you can have trouble free double the power. I put my setup together piece by piece, so I saved money by buying just what I needed, one piece at a time. I was able to buy a freshly serviced D1 that I was able to call procharger, and get confirmation of when it was put into service, and when the last service was done to it, for less than $2000.
Again, it's about what you want, what you can afford, what your skills are, and if you prefer building your car or driving your car.
For everyone saying turbos are easy, just browse this section and look at how many turbo help threads there are compared to blowers. Sure, there are more turbo setups, but the problems with them are there as well. A blower isn't as picky about camshaft selection, and exhaust setup as a turbo is.
With a procharger, you don't have to worry about breaking welds, how to route oil feed and return lines (just search how many threads are on that subject alone), camshaft selection, motor size, exhaust size going to the turbo, exhaust size out of the turbo.
Turbos are great, I have one on my daily driver 4-cylinder, but unless you have someone with experience with them, I wouldn't recommend it for a novice.
04-16-2016, 07:54 AM
#102
Agree with Alchemist above.
For me when I finally dipped my toe into the FI world a turbo system was something that I didn't fully understand or better put I didn't have confidence in my working knowledge and ability to sustain the system. A simple blower ( at the time it was a Maggie) was something I could wrap my head around & have confidence in. Bolt on in a sho period of time with few issues. The Maggie system certainly taught me many lessons of the FI world.
For a weekend fun car, street warrior 500 -800 rwhp, a blower is for me.
To narrow it down I'd go with a Centri ( ProCharger at that). & buy it from Bob ... He's a good guy.
Now, back to the original spirit of this thread.
" are 189* IATs ok for my PD setup"
" what pulley size do I need for 20 lbs boost on my Maggie" ...... You will need to spin it on the shaft itself & spray liquid nitrogen all over your top end to keep from detinating.
For me when I finally dipped my toe into the FI world a turbo system was something that I didn't fully understand or better put I didn't have confidence in my working knowledge and ability to sustain the system. A simple blower ( at the time it was a Maggie) was something I could wrap my head around & have confidence in. Bolt on in a sho period of time with few issues. The Maggie system certainly taught me many lessons of the FI world.
For a weekend fun car, street warrior 500 -800 rwhp, a blower is for me.
To narrow it down I'd go with a Centri ( ProCharger at that). & buy it from Bob ... He's a good guy.
Now, back to the original spirit of this thread.
" are 189* IATs ok for my PD setup"
" what pulley size do I need for 20 lbs boost on my Maggie" ...... You will need to spin it on the shaft itself & spray liquid nitrogen all over your top end to keep from detinating.
04-16-2016, 08:49 AM
#103
If you can't build a turbo system correctly and keep it running without issues you probably shouldn't be messing with cars. It is a bullet proof power adder, it's been proven for 50 years
Sucks all that OEM stuff cracking welds and turbos falling off n **** and those pesky oil lines
A PD has merit and has proved itself for a very long time
Sucks all that OEM stuff cracking welds and turbos falling off n **** and those pesky oil lines
A PD has merit and has proved itself for a very long time
04-16-2016, 09:55 AM
#104
If you can't build a turbo system correctly and keep it running without issues you probably shouldn't be messing with cars. It is a bullet proof power adder, it's been proven for 50 years
Sucks all that OEM stuff cracking welds and turbos falling off n **** and those pesky oil lines
A PD has merit and has proved itself for a very long time
Sucks all that OEM stuff cracking welds and turbos falling off n **** and those pesky oil lines
A PD has merit and has proved itself for a very long time
04-16-2016, 10:52 AM
#106
If you can't build a turbo system correctly and keep it running without issues you probably shouldn't be messing with cars. It is a bullet proof power adder, it's been proven for 50 years
Sucks all that OEM stuff cracking welds and turbos falling off n **** and those pesky oil lines
A PD has merit and has proved itself for a very long time
Sucks all that OEM stuff cracking welds and turbos falling off n **** and those pesky oil lines
A PD has merit and has proved itself for a very long time
I Can't argue with the proven tech of a turbo & PD still have good place in the FI world ...... Just keeping the light hearted thread moving.
All good.
04-16-2016, 10:57 AM
#107
But ask yourself why that is.. It's not the turbo charger.. It's the stupid people trying to put them together like I said earlier. S/C are just dummy proof. The competent turbo user are killing the SC guys in all aspects in these HP ranges we mess with
04-17-2016, 08:32 AM
#109
http://www.supercars.net/cars/5353.html
04-17-2016, 11:32 AM
#110
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In the 4+ years now of running a procharger, first with a D1sc at max rpm, and now with an F1a at about 80%, I have never tossed a belt, or shredded a belt. The only time I did, it was my fault for overtightening an idler pulley and crushing the bearing, which caused it to fail and lock up, which then took out the belt.
It's not 2003 anymore people. Pick up a D1 or F1a, an Aster bracket, an ebay FMIC, and supporting fuel mods and you have a very reliable 600-900rwhp setup.
It's not 2003 anymore people. Pick up a D1 or F1a, an Aster bracket, an ebay FMIC, and supporting fuel mods and you have a very reliable 600-900rwhp setup.
I think it's safe to assume that a lot of the "faults" encountered with either setup are due to operator error.
04-17-2016, 02:10 PM
#111
For me personally the blower works great. I love turbo's and on my friends TT 5th gen they work great. The kit was packaged well and makes 1100 on his highest setting. For a vette though they don't work as well. A few people make kits but no matter which one you get they are always having some sort of issues. When they work they are amazing that's a fact. The problem is I like to drive a lot on back roads, take a short road trip, make highway pulls over & over, but I can't do that if I have to chase down turbo setup gremlins. If not for that I wouldn't mind having twins on my car with a nice boost controller setup. I can hop in my car and go anywhere and it drive as normal as can be until I want to feel all 900whp. Just a personal preference though. I have no belt issue cause I know that will be brought up. Enjoy what you enjoy.
04-17-2016, 04:51 PM
#112
Originally Posted by Detoxx03
For me personally the blower works great. I love turbo's and on my friends TT 5th gen they work great. The kit was packaged well and makes 1100 on his highest setting. For a vette though they don't work as well. A few people make kits but no matter which one you get they are always having some sort of issues. When they work they are amazing that's a fact. The problem is I like to drive a lot on back roads, take a short road trip, make highway pulls over & over, but I can't do that if I have to chase down turbo setup gremlins. If not for that I wouldn't mind having twins on my car with a nice boost controller setup. I can hop in my car and go anywhere and it drive as normal as can be until I want to feel all 900whp. Just a personal preference though. I have no belt issue cause I know that will be brought up. Enjoy what you enjoy.
04-17-2016, 08:22 PM
#113
The TT vettes keep everything. They aren't like f bodies where you lose AC etc. For some weird reason they alway have some nagging issue. Other than that though they run their *** off. My friend is gonna put up his SC setup for sale soon cause he wants a UPP TT kit. He has no issues now other than he wants more power and doesn't want to upgrade headunits. For his sake I hope it's not down more than he enjoys driving.
04-17-2016, 08:27 PM
#114
Originally Posted by Detoxx03
The TT vettes keep everything. They aren't like f bodies where you lose AC etc. For some weird reason they alway have some nagging issue. Other than that though they run their *** off. My friend is gonna put up his SC setup for sale soon cause he wants a UPP TT kit. He has no issues now other than he wants more power and doesn't want to upgrade headunits. For his sake I hope it's not down more than he enjoys driving.
04-18-2016, 03:57 PM
#119
and corvette turbo kits are well sorted out.. no one wants to pay for them thas the issue. i do agree blowers are easier to install... but goddamn im so tired of hearing about how easy they are to install... **** that. the power is what matters
04-18-2016, 10:09 PM
#120
Turbos are exhaust propelled, and blowers are driven off the crank, a belt is trying to rip it out, which would you prefer
and corvette turbo kits are well sorted out.. no one wants to pay for them thas the issue. i do agree blowers are easier to install... but goddamn im so tired of hearing about how easy they are to install... **** that. the power is what matters
and corvette turbo kits are well sorted out.. no one wants to pay for them thas the issue. i do agree blowers are easier to install... but goddamn im so tired of hearing about how easy they are to install... **** that. the power is what matters