fastassls1maro

iTrader: (22)

here is the whole back story if you're interested
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...pic-heavy.html

here is what happened last year shortly after going turbo(about 1500 miles on turbo setup)
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...-now-what.html

so over winter i did a complete rebuild. sent the shortblock to the machine shop and had them go over it. they didnt find anything except the #1 and #2 rod big ends were slightly egg shaped but they were able to recondition them back to round. They also cut the crank journal .010" and magnafluxed it. I assembled the engine with new clevite bearings and a new melling 10296 oil pump. Everything was working great again and had 60+ psi of oil pressure at idle and close to 80psi at wot. I put around 200 miles on the engine and started noticing my oil pressure was dropping at idle, sometime down to 10psi. So i drained the oil and cut the oil filter apart to find an abundance of copper shavings just like last year. I couldn't hear it knocking this time so i think i saved it from any critical damage.

so here i am again.......looking for some ideas
- could this be tune related??? i never had any problems with the engine in 4 years until i put the turbo on it last year.


any help is greatly appreciated

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

What oil pan/pickup? Do you data log oil pressure? Probably starving it for oil under acceleration. Esp. with the high volume oil pump and center pickup oil pans.

3 window

iTrader: (1)

What kind of oil are you running? Are you running any additional oil? Some turbo setups add a quart or quart and a half to the oil to compensate for the oil the turbo and lines use up. Also the oil should be able to handle the additional heat that the turbo creates. If your starving the engine of oil on accel due to low volume or the oil is getting excessively hot, either could cause an issue.

fastassls1maro

iTrader: (22)

factory f-body oil pan and pickup, i am not logging oil pressure but i do have a mechanical autometer oil pressure gauge i watch very closely. Last year i ran only brad penn 10w40 in it. This year i started out with pennzoil 10w40 with some zinc additive but never made it long enough to start using brad penn again. I was running 6 quarts of oil in it.

denmah

iTrader: (2)

f body pan and center pickup most likely problem for sure, i agree

fastassls1maro

iTrader: (22)

if the f body pan and pickup are the problem hows come i havent seen anyone else with this problem before, as it seems like everyone runs the stock pan and pickup on camaros?
also am i correct in thinking that #1 and #2 rod bearings are the last in line to receive oil? Could overfueling cause this? i noticed on some of my wot pulls the afr was dipping as low as 10.0:1. The oil did not smell like fuel so i dont think that it was contaminated.

3 window

iTrader: (1)

Oil slosh could be the culprite. Forget why everyone else can do this or that. Yes, one and two would be the last bearings oiled, but once there's oil in the gallies, there's oil in the gallies. It's if it's starved or the pump cavitates is when there's a problem. Excessively rich can dilute oil. As far as I know, most widebands only read down to 10.0 even though it could be richer yet. I could be wrong though. I'd change the bearings (obviously clean everyhing), add ADDITIONAL oil to the pan and lean out the rich issues and try it.

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

It is common. Look up oil starvation and fbody pan. Esp. when running an after market high volume pump. You basicaly pump the pan level too low with the high volume pump and uncover the pickup under hard acceleration. You dont see this issue on stock camaros because they run the oem pump and dont accelerate near as fast. This is especially common at drag strip when your 60' times get down in the 1.4x or faster range...even with oem pump. With an aftermarket pump, i logged my pressure dropping on hard street pulls. U need a rear sump pan, or an oil accumulator. Can also run a few extra qts of oil. 7-7.5 is common with that pan.

JoeNova

High volume pump + F-body pan + Lots of horsepower = Lots of failures.
Any 2 of those might be okay together, all 3 is a disaster.

rotary1307cc

iTrader: (5)

No problems here with all 3

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

Didn’t I read you restrict oil flow to the top end with roll pins in the push rods and run a ton of oil though? Obviously the OP isn’t doing that…

I could watch my pressure drop on the mechanical gauge with 5.5qts and the high volume OEM“DOD” pump just accelerating hard on the street.

I’m running the extreme racing baffle now, standard truck pump, and 7qts. I still see a drop in pressure on the line at the track on hard launches. Esp. if I pick the nose up a good amount. I don’t restrict oil to the lifters though, suppose I’ll try that next.

At this point I think an accumulator would have been easier/cheaper than farting around with all the baffles and other “tricks” with this pan. Probably work better too.

RonSSNova

iTrader: (3)

Or just change to a better pan. Like a Mast or Holley if they fit.

Although the harness isn't wired for it, the oil pressure pins are there in the ECU and are active.
I actually hooked mine up to a fuel pressure sensor.

Ron

rotary1307cc

iTrader: (5)

My old motor with stock lifters I restricted. New nice engine isn't restricted but with Johnson lifters. 8qt with an old non trap door IR baffle

RedRocketZ28

iTrader: (19)

I run the same oil pump and pan in my car without issue. The engine has been in the car for over 3 years without issue. I do run about 7 quarts of oil though.

Forcefed86

iTrader: (4)

Think the 60’ and angle of nose/pan also has a lot to go with it. I’ve seen some pretty level leaving cars hit 1.2x 60’ and I’ve seen some with the wheels 3ft off the ground.

forcd ind

iTrader: (7)

Detonation will knock bearings out, what do the plugs look like
Have you pulled the pan, or just checked the filter
Possible its from the thrust bearing, I have seen some pretty
bad ones

Dimeomboost

Not to thread hijack but definitely interested in this have had two completely different motors the only thing that both had in common was oil pump brand new on first motor for 300 miles then about 10 passes on the bone stock motor. One motor was fully built other was bone stock except the pump and cam ruined 1&2 rods in first motor forged eagle h beams fresh line bore and block bored to ls1 size. Other motor was stock 5.3 and in 10 passes it got 3 and 4 rods same oil pump used on both ported ls6 with red rubber o ring truck pan and pickup how did I lose two motors in less than 1k miles when one had every internal part replaced possible sorry for confusing post just trying to be clear on the different motors but same pump pan cam and pickup

dburt86

iTrader: (2)

to the guys over filling the f body pans,

how are you determining its the proper amount

looking to do this my self.

Just dump in 7 and let it eat?

rotary1307cc

iTrader: (5)

Dump it in mark your dipstick

8 will not get to the block skirt

fastassls1maro

iTrader: (22)

ok i finally got some time to tear this thing apart. I decided to tear it apart in the car just to see how bad it was before i pulled the engine. Ill let the pics speak for themselves.






the rod bearings dont look great but i believe most of the damage was from lack of oil due to bad mains. Its weird that #1 main looks relatively ok and then 2,3, and 4 are trashed. I was unable to pull #5 main since the rear cover is still on. Nothing shows any signs of excessive heat, and there isnt any scoring on the crank just some copper sheen.

crank was turned .010" and clevite .010" bearings were used
here are the specs from when i assembled
all main bearing clearances were .002"
crankshaft endplay was .004"
rode bearing clearances were .002"


now what??