View Poll Results: Would you install an "off-the-shelf cam" dot-to-dot?
Voters: 113. You may not vote on this poll
Dot-to-dot.. or not?
TECH Resident
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 801
Likes: 1
From: Anaheim Ca.
That thing was so retarted, I had to advance the crank sprocket one tooth and then retarded it 4 deg with a with a crankshaft key just get it "stright up". One again check it or chance it. So you have to ask yourself one question " do I feel lucky?" Well do you punk? (Clint Eastwood line) lol
Last edited by slow ride 02; Jan 7, 2009 at 02:06 PM. Reason: added
Everything that goes into an engine should be checked and recheck to make sure it's right.
Degree the cam.
Assuming something is right without checking it just sets one up for problems.
Sure it's right 99.9% of the time...it's those .1% that add up and eventually burn you if you don't check everything!
Degree the cam.
Assuming something is right without checking it just sets one up for problems.
Sure it's right 99.9% of the time...it's those .1% that add up and eventually burn you if you don't check everything!
If you should be banned then I should be castrated for installing my custom 231/232 .612/.592 111+4 cam dot to dot. I should have degreed it in as the car is not making near the power it should. Figured everything was good to go since I had the cam doctor sheet and all. I think I'm goin to tear it apart this spring just to make sure it is installed correctly.
If you should be banned then I should be castrated for installing my custom 231/232 .612/.592 111+4 cam dot to dot. I should have degreed it in as the car is not making near the power it should. Figured everything was good to go since I had the cam doctor sheet and all. I think I'm goin to tear it apart this spring just to make sure it is installed correctly.
I would say it really depends on the application. If it is a race only or all out HP setup, then yes degree it. If it is just for a street application that street races (not for money) or is daily driven, then no. All of you who say every cam install should be degreed, did you also check to ensure your primary lengths on your headers were optomized and did you alter the collector length to where your application needed it or did you just bolt-on a set of off the shelf headers? What about your intake, did you install an off the shelf intake or did you tune the runners and plenum volume? 
Interesting! I bet most did not, only those seeking that last 5 hp, which as I said ... it depends on the application.
Now on big(ger) cams I would definately at least check PTVC.
BTW, to me degreeing a cam is not checking the advertised specs (int dur./exh dur., LSA), but rather the valve timing events (IVO, IVC, EVO, EVC), that tells you more (clearer) about the cam.
Interesting! I bet most did not, only those seeking that last 5 hp, which as I said ... it depends on the application.Now on big(ger) cams I would definately at least check PTVC.
BTW, to me degreeing a cam is not checking the advertised specs (int dur./exh dur., LSA), but rather the valve timing events (IVO, IVC, EVO, EVC), that tells you more (clearer) about the cam.
What I want to know is what adjustable timing set everyone recommends? I know the double rollers do not fit with out griding your timing cover. So what is a good setup to use, single roller adjustable or dual roller if the clearance thing is no big deal. Also at a decent price.
I would say it really depends on the application. If it is a race only or all out HP setup, then yes degree it. If it is just for a street application that street races (not for money) or is daily driven, then no. All of you who say every cam install should be degreed, did you also check to ensure your primary lengths on your headers were optomized and did you alter the collector length to where your application needed it or did you just bolt-on a set of off the shelf headers? What about your intake, did you install an off the shelf intake or did you tune the runners and plenum volume? Interesting! I bet most did not, only those seeking that last 5 hp, which as I said ... it depends on the application.
Now on big(ger) cams I would definately at least check PTVC.
BTW, to me degreeing a cam is not checking the advertised specs (int dur./exh dur., LSA), but rather the valve timing events (IVO, IVC, EVO, EVC), that tells you more (clearer) about the cam.
Interesting! I bet most did not, only those seeking that last 5 hp, which as I said ... it depends on the application.Now on big(ger) cams I would definately at least check PTVC.
BTW, to me degreeing a cam is not checking the advertised specs (int dur./exh dur., LSA), but rather the valve timing events (IVO, IVC, EVO, EVC), that tells you more (clearer) about the cam.
if your cam has been proven to be cut right then i agree dot to dot is ok...otherwise it needs to be checked by degreeing it, or as you said checking the valve events...
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it doesnt matter weather your dot to dot or both dots up. the cam turns half the rotation as the crank. i could careless about degreeing a cam. the motor isnt going to last long enough in my hands to matter. Turn up the boost
The last cam that I just installed was off by 2 1/2 degrees. If you are planning a heads/cam setup and trying to get optimum SCR and DCR and peak power, changing the cam advance 2-4 degrees changes the valve events you so carefully planned out. So yes, I would degree the cam.
Your camshaft doesn't stay exactly where you install it. There are many forces changing many things, the cam deflects, the cam doesnt turn exactly 1/2 the speed of the crank in a smooth fashion, its rotation speeds up and slows back down independantly.
All your timing points/valve events, and even durations change dramtically at speed (RPM) and you have no way of measuring or knowing what is REALLY happening... All these super calculations of dynamic compression and getting everthing to the Nth degree makes you feel good, sure. Its making it the best you can, also correct. But is is not black an white the way people try to make it sound.
12 Second Club
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 334
Likes: 0
From: jonesville, MI
TorchD02TA, I would not waste the time rechecking your cam...it put down some good numbers...similar to mine. I'd bet it is pretty much right on the money. BTW, the car sounds great and looks badass...well done! Did you ever get a set of 4.10's?
Like when my builder refreshed my ls1 I bought a brand new ms4. And it ms4 is .649 intake lift and .609 exhaust. And it really had .640 and .614 exhaust. The duration was off by one or two degrees the lsa came as said (112). But he said good thing it had smaller lift cuz .650 if the MAX lift I could have gone. So I say degree it!!!!!
TECH Resident
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 848
Likes: 1
From: Working in the shop 24/7
Launching!
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
From: Walterboro SC
TSP tsunami 235/240 .647/.609 111lsa Dot to Dot. Spun it over by hand to check PTV clearance. 
Didn't have an adjustable timing chain and was using a budies garage so it wouldn't have mattered either way.
When I do my underdrive pulley and go back in there to do a timing chain I will probaby degree it for piece of mind.
Didn't have an adjustable timing chain and was using a budies garage so it wouldn't have mattered either way.
When I do my underdrive pulley and go back in there to do a timing chain I will probaby degree it for piece of mind.
