WS6GMguy

Hello I'm new to the forums this is my first post. I have been around on the forums reading a lot but I was curious what kind of numbers do you guys think ill be running and what do you all think of the build overall. I recently cracked a piston in my LS1. so I'm doing a new build. this is my first engine build so anything you guys can come up with tips, knowledge and any guidance/ experience with brands or parts please let me know. I'm here to learn. anyways my build.

I have 02 Trans am WS6, M6, 3.42 Rear end (will change once i get money)

bought a LM7 bored out to a 5.7L Short block from ATK Engines.
Block- 5.3l Iron block
Bore/Stroke- 3.903x 3.622
Crank- OE Reground 0.010/ 0.010
Rods- Scat Premium pro 4340 I-beam w/ ARP
Pistons- Wiseco 2618 Forged -3.2CC Flat top piston. Moly Skirt coated
Rings- Wiseco GFX (alloy steel top ring)

I Got TSP 225 As-Cast Heads with .660 dual springs 62CC
Cam- TSP TV4 231/234 .619/.612 111LSA
Rollmaster Single roller timing set
LS7 Lifters
7.450 Push rods from TSP (I will be checking length)
GM Performance Oil pump

ill be running stock intake/ injectors at first. I was going to go with a TSP mail order tune at first because me being stationed down here in Yuma AZ. theres like 0 performance shops that I know of that runs a dyno. nor any that i trust around here haha.

Exhaust
its a SLP loudmouth 2.
BBK longtube headers 2.5inch ORY pipe. (going Catless most likely.)

looking at a ls7 clutch and new steel flywheel.

one thing I'm kind of split is which head gasket to use. I was told with a GM .051 head gasket my compression ratio was going to be if I remember correctly it was 10.6.5. which I think that's a little low, which makes since sense i have the -3.2cc in the pistons but i didn't know it would effect it that bad? but once again this is my first build i have a lot of learning to do lol. but i was hoping to have higher compression. which if im trying to have a good DD that lays down good power. (my goal is right around 500 to the wheels.) which im sure im gonna fall short. but as long as its ball park obtainable with a intake/ injectors ill be really happy with my build.

If you have any questions please do ask.

93madness

iTrader: (1)

I guess hinesight is 20/20 but if it were me...with a forged bottom end like that and injectors, etc...I'd just got a junkyard 5.3 for pennies put a turbo on it and 500whp would have been nothing. It's actually my planned route for my '93 Camaro project I'm working on.

tech@WS6store

iTrader: (2)

I would run stock head gasket and not worry. running higher esp in those temps in ariz isnt good.

kingtal0n

iTrader: (1)

I agree with above poster, JY 5.3 + turbo means you "start out" with 400+ horsepower,

and the engine can be worthless trashed,

and you lost nothing. Get another one.

The car becomes a "500 horsepower car" even when there is no engine installed (because any engine you install feeds off the turbo which never leaves the car)

93madness

iTrader: (1)

WS6GMguy welcome btw!

As far as the #'s go....it really depends...and which numbers do you mean? E.T.? HP? Which HP...FWHP, RWHP? On what kind of Dyno? There's dozens and dozens of variables from weight of the car, to parts used, to competency of the tuner, to tire size, to the temperature outside, type of fuel ran...the list is rather long lol.

WS6GMguy

Sorry, I should of clarified that earlier. I was trying to go with a 500hp N/A car. wasn't trying to go boosted.

WS6GMguy

yeah I figured I was forgetting somethings, but off pump gas most likely 93, full weight car. around here in Yuma gets 125 all day and night here. lol its retarded. lol. I might need to go to San diego but nervous about them telling me my car is illegal (which i would be) and hold my car. lol

93madness

iTrader: (1)

No offense to CA folks but yea I'd stay away from that idea...CARB rules are crazy and you'll be hunted the second you cross the state line lol. With what you're looking for goal wise...I don't see why not..it's really all in the Heads, Intake, and Cam then a good tune. Others may have more info but I feel like you should be able to hit those numbers pretty comfortably.

Darth_V8r

iTrader: (4)

My opinion your intake and exhaust selections are going to hamstring your build.

Your build list will put you in 430-450 territory as it stands right now. Thats rear tire.

You're going to need to step up to a fast102 intake and a compatible throttle. I'd also suggest you go with 1-7/8 headers into a 3" dual exhaust. Those changes will get you much closer to 500.

Then, if you plan to stick with LS7 lifters and clutch you're going to need more cam. Along the lines of 241/244. If you want to keep the cam moderate, then you'll need to budget for reduction of load to free up ponies, such as lighter clutch, electric water pump, manual steering or turn one pump.

z-maro

iTrader: (18)

Not to be negative but that is not a 500 RWHP combo. The LS7 clutch is heavy and will rob power, BBK headers are 1-3/4" I believe and the 2.5" Y is less than ideal, LS7 lifters and stock diameter pushrods will leave some power on the table. Not saying it won't be a fun combo but I'd be surprised to see much over 450 at the wheels.

Some things I'd recommend are upgraded rocker trunnions and 11/16 pushrods, or 3/8 if they will fit your heads. Also I didn't see a mention of an intake, gonna need a ported 102 or MSD to get towards your goals. 500 will take new exhaust, lifters, and clutch at a minimum.

WS6GMguy

I already have the Comp Cams Trunion upgrade. (stock rockers), whats wrong with the LS7 lifters? I heard they are good lifters? same thing with pushrods?
ive heard the 3" exhaust isn't really a big gain between the 2.5. which I s why I went with the set up. I heard the only way you would benefit the 3" is at the higher RPMS?

and overall I did plan on running another intake but I'm not sure which one I wanna run with. I have a LS6 intake right now. but I know the 76MM TB and intake port is failing.

WS6GMguy

with that type of cam wouldn't that almost not be streetable? because I do need to have this as if I were to daily drive it.

tech@WS6store

iTrader: (2)

The idea of blowing a jy motor up and chalking it up to "oh well get another" is kinda ridiculous. It costs both time and money for all that. Spending money 2,3,4 times is not very smart honestly.
Building it how you want used to be respected now everyone jumps on the jy and boost it idea and look down on anything else.
Build what you want op. We have anything you need, parts, advice, tech info for anything you are looking for.

Darth_V8r

iTrader: (4)

Streetable is a relative term. But no to me that cam would not be streetable.

500 on a 5.7 with a moderate cam NA can be done but it's gotta be highly optimized to do it. Here's some examples - but I'm going to warn you that if you look at these all individual mods you'll say they don't do much. But when you add them up, it's how you get there.

Short travel lifters. You lose a lot less travel and response time between lifter and valve.

Larger diameter pushrods. Pushrods can be like pole-vaults. You need them NOT to flex.

Roller rockers. He stock type rocker has a progressive ratio. At low lift it's only 1.4-1.5. Roller tips stay a true 1.7 ratio at all lifts. Trunion upgrade won't fix this.

Electric water pump. Light clutch.

When I went from a 3"Y to a 3"dual it made a tremendous change to the car.

kingtal0n

iTrader: (1)

It is statistically relevant that OEM engines tend to last longer than 'built' engines at 'moderate' power levels (building an engine well is 'difficult'). We just use the clause "throw it away if necessary" to provide the back drop for such use, i.e. a small investment for potentially a long life engine, but if for whatever reason it turns out bad, you can get another at very little expense. The same can not be said for built engines, which often cost ten times what a JY version of the same displacement and potentially hundreds of thousands more miles of use costs.


random thread:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-in...l#post19525070

tech@WS6store

iTrader: (2)

There is a reason the big money builds use high quality aftermarket parts but also have a quality shop machine it.
Ebay turbos last too but you wont see me telling anyone to use them just like chinese head studs.

Welcome to the forum OP hope you brought popcorn! And a flame suit...

kingtal0n

iTrader: (1)

It isn't necessarily the parts. Lets say all parts are always perfect. Then, there is the question of probability involved with opening/moving/changing them. First, a sample statistic: Lets say Jim has an 80% chance to decode a message, and Jane has a 70% chance to decode the same message. Taken together, the chance that one of them will be able to decode the message is something like 95%. Probability jumps significantly as you add more chances overall for an similar outcome. When building an engine, there are hundreds of little chances for things to turn out wrong. Lets say there is a 0.4% chance that a specific O-ring goes in wrong, a 1.2% chance that the deck isn't the right hardness, a 0.08% chance the cylinder bore isn't shaped right, a 2.7% chance one of the bearings isn't clearance properly, etc... the list gets pretty long when you consider each individual statistic. Taken together the overall chances of one of these things being poor enough to cause catastrophic failure or poor performance is quite high. The factory undoubtedly runs these statistical analysis before assembling an engine/vehicle and determines where and how to minimize the risks, and even so new vettes come with blow-by and new trucks come with poor transmission performance, etc... In other words, things still go wrong in present day manufacturing.


In lieu of this knowledge, lets take another look at junkyard engines produced between a specific era using the factory's detailed analysis in the past. In other words, we can predict an engine's future by comparing other engines produced in the same manner by the same factory, something you cannot do when it comes to a 1-off built engine. For example, Lets say 90% of all 5.3L engines from 2000 to 2002 are making it to 200,000 miles in work trucks with very little issue. Many of them may not be well maintained; sludge and muck abound, and yet here they are, still running. This gives you a much higher percentage chance (confidence) that the JY engine you select which appears to be in good condition is going to keep running for many miles (lets say you find one with 100k, well most of them hit 200k so that is 10~ years of driving 10k per year you can bet on with minimal risk, provided you do nothing to damage the engine) Now, the other side of the issue is the intended use: we must compare this high mileage statistic with the slew of individuals who have taken these 17~ year old junkyard engines and made double OEM horsepower reliably for 50,000+ additional miles and report little/no issues. After all, It doesn't do us any good if the motor can hit 200k unmodified, but when you double it's output suddenly it falls apart most of the time.

Thus the typical LSx of 2000~ fulfill these requirements: they are well known to achieve high mileage at double power output with minimal modifications. The risk is reduced significantly overall, regardless of cost, when an attempt is made. When you factor in the low cost as an added benefit- the JY engine becomes an obscenely obvious choice over anything 'built', due to the history/reliability vs cost at 'moderate' power level (often taken to be around double the OEM output, or approx 500-600 horsepower).

tech@WS6store

iTrader: (2)

I understand the idea of jy engines. I dont agree with saying they can be used interchangeably with a built engine. Most early 00 era engines have excessive oil consumption and pcv/blowby issues as normal as well. Putting bandaids like catch cans and breathers on them isnt the same as running a proper built engine. Those engines are also known for lifting ring lands as well as the 07 nnbs 5.3 when gn swapped rings for VERY excessive oil consumption and stock l92 engines around that time to 2010 for dropping valves. And then there is the ls7 valve issue also. Also the tbss ls2 and gto ls1 and 2 have major issues as well, some of that possibly being pan design and tuning but the rest being the parts involved. l99s and l76s have the afm lifter issues. There are many many more tsbs etc that document all of that.
The machine work going into building a proper setup is key. Parts selection is second. The rest is all based off either budget or who is designing the build.
Stock parts can be pushed to limits, but i wont pretend they are the same limits as aftermarket.