Deeavi

iTrader: (16)

I have not posted in a while, but I saw this thread and thought I would chime in. My car is a daily driver, in and out of traffic. I had a 224/112 cam and it was lacking on the low end torque side.

I switched to a VINCE/Crane 056 cam with 216/224 dur @.050, 551 lift @ valve, and 115 degree LSA. It makes a ton of torque. I was having it dynoed when it broke the lockup on my TCI 2500 converter at close to 400 ft lbs of torque. My transmission has 106,000 miles on it so when we ran it unlocked it only pulled 367 ft lbs. of torque. I think you would like this cam. I love it! It pulls strong past 6000 rpms and it also has a nice choppy idle which I like.

SSCoulter

iTrader: (4)

Thanks! That sounds exactly like the cam I want.

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

That Vinci cam is a good one, but not as good as that same cam on a 113LSA. It will be even torquier. Vinci sells that one too. They also sell the 113LSA cam with more lift. If I was going to buy a Vinci cam, THAT's the one I'd get.

But if you really want abundant low end torque, you're going to want an Ausie cam (smaller duration, narrower LSA). You won't get many recommendations for them because not many people in North America have tried them.

SSCoulter

iTrader: (4)

Thanks, I was leaning toward the duration and lift he was talking about not the LSA so much. Thanks to you and a few others I am convinced the smaller duration, narrower LSA is the way to go. 216/224 midium lift and a narrow LSA is the ticket I think.

patSS/00

iTrader: (6)

Why would smaller LSA = more low end torque? I thought for more torque you wanted less overlap = more LSA ...?

Patrick G

iTrader: (14)

Overlap is amount of time the exhaust lobe and intake lobe overlap each other. LSA is only a small component of this. Duration counts much more.

For example
210/216 106LSA cam = 1 degree of overlap at .050"
220/226 110LSA cam = 3 degrees of overlap at .050"
230/236 114LSA cam = 5 degrees of overlap at .050"

So even though my LSA got 4 degrees wider in each successive cam, the overlap grew as well. LSA and overlap do not necessarily go hand in hand.

Deeavi

iTrader: (16)

With your M6 I believe the 113 LSA would probably be the better choice also!

DaddySS

I'd also like to results from a CheaTR cam on a headers or heads and headers car - I bet it will make some serious numbers.

SSCoulter

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for everyone's input. I have decided to go with the Vinci 062 cam. Here are the specs.

"ASP-KICKER 2" Ultra torque cam
STREET / STRIP CAM - HIGH LIFT
POWER RANGE 1900 TO 6000
CRISP THROTTLE RESPONSE - LOADS OF "TORQUE"
" DRIVE - INN " IDLE

DUR @ .050" 210*/218*LIFT .551 / .551 OVERLAP 52* LSA 112*

Corpsvette

So will this have a lot of lope? Not sure what drive inn idle is. Love this thread. What to do, what to do?

Jim K

SSCoulter

iTrader: (4)

According to Vinci, it will have a nice consistent lope. Not like a real big cam that you can tell the computer is always searching for a smooth idle and the lope is always changing. They have a sound clip on their web sit of this cam. They are a sponsor here.

SsZERO

I've been reading a lot of cam threads, and this is probably the most interesting one. Right now I am running a TR230/224 "Reverse Split" cam on 111 LSA, and I would say it is "ok". With stock heads, u/d pulley, elec. water pump and hooker LTs I put down 370 RWHP / 359 RWTQ.

I am about to do a cam swap, and I pretty much want the same thing - more low end torque from idle on up. This cam I have now had a noticeable drop in low-end grunt, even with tuning.

Can someone recommend me a cam that will work well with the mods I mentioned and be able to pass state emissions? I do not care much if it is lopey or not. My current considerations were:

MTI Stealth Cam II
F14
TR CheaTR
TR Old Man Cam
Cam Mentioned in this thread:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iii-internal-engine/72972-224-224-110lsa-106icl-cam-dyno-results-very-happy.html

I like the idea of that aussie came with the low intake duration and higher exhaust duration...

Which of the above cams would pass emissions, and of those which would provide the best results?

SSCoulter

iTrader: (4)

I'm glad I'm not the only one that feels this way. I don't give a crap about the dyno numbers. To many "Dyno Queens" running around out there now. I want a car that pulls like a freight train between idle and 6k. Stoplight to stoplight, yeah come get some.

DaddySS

Keep us posted on how it turns out!

Cal

iTrader: (1)

I'd love to race you from stoplight to stoplight with my "over-cammed" dyno queen.

SSCoulter

iTrader: (4)

Touched a nerve uh? lol

Cal

iTrader: (1)

Nope, didn't touch a nerve with me. I just think you're missing out to go with that smaller cam. But then, I went with a small cam the first time too, and I think many people have wound up doing two cam swaps. Seriously, if you don't have it installed yet, I would consider trading it for at least a 224 cam. I doubt you could tell that "kicker" cam from stock if blindfolded. The stock cam is actually the best "torque" cam you could have. But what do you want, a tractor or a race car?

PREDATOR-Z

I think you are missing the point. TRQ and HP are directly related. Trq is what gives you a good 60' which is where 70% of the races are won. Why do people go big cubes? For more trq.

Combo, combo, combo

blkZ28spt

Yes, combo is where it's at. There is a reason that BIG cams are at the top of the "fastests XXX" lists. They make more power and when the car is set up for them, they are faster. (all else equal)

Cal

iTrader: (1)

Torque is just rotational force, has nothing to do with energy. Horsepower is the time rate of doing work, and is what wins races. I could apply a large amount of force to a brick wall, but it the wall does not move, I've haven't done any work. Work is defined as applying a force over a distance, and is expressed in the same units as energy.

OK here's another example: A large diesel semi-truck has to pull huge loads up steep hills. It needs torque to do this, but we really don't care how long it takes, as long as it does it. The engine in this truck might only have 150 hp, but it has 600 ft-lbs of torque.

In contrast, a dedicated race car is lightweight and doesn't need a lot of torque to move it's weight. It may have only 150 ft-lbs of torque, but it has 600 hp. We are most interested in how FAST the race car can do it's job, not how much weight it can pull.

As for combo, take a look at his sig. He has an fbody, not a truck so he is not towing nor does he have a heavy vehicle. He has an LS1 engine with 4.10 gears, so he isn't hurting for torque at the rear axle. A better match for his combo is a cam with some duration IMO.

You probably think my cam is too big, but my dyno graph shows that it is putting out almost 300 ft-lbs of torque at 1750 rpm. That's a pretty low rpm to launch at, and capable of spinning any tire through 4.11 gears. Peak torque is 400 fl-lbs at 4800 rpm. LS1 engines are putting out as mush torque as big block engines did in the old days.