strength of Eagle "H" beam rods...
10-21-2006, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by skipperbisket
just like the title says... how do they compare to some of the other brands on the market?
10-22-2006, 02:45 AM
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Manley is far superior to Eagle in material and machining. Just because they both say "4340" does not make them equal, try drilling on a chinese crank and then compare it to an american Crower or Bryant crank...the chinese junk cuts like butter and is very soft in comparison. The tolerances I have seen on eagle stuff is all over the place, +/- .007 on rod sizing, .002 taper across journals, etc...I have never sold eagle products, and only touch them when a customer brings them to me asking why his crank will not turn or when it exploded at 7500rpm on the backside of turn 2 and now needs a good motor.
10-22-2006, 10:08 AM
#6
FormerVendor
I would say the Eagles can take anything you can throw their way and unlike machinistone I have used tons of Eagle rods and nothing is farther from the truth about their quality. The Eagle connecting rods are within a ten thousandth or two on size between each other almost everytime in any set and they are also very very round every time. I've used almost every rod made for LS1s and the SBC and the Eagles are very nice.
We've used regular SBC Eagle rods even in many 1000 plus HP engines. The LS1 specific on center rod (625g) however is a medium weight and is probably not quite as strong as the normal heavier SBC rods (670g). Both can be used in an LS1 depending on setup and pistons. Tons of very reputable shops from World Products to Roush to Shafiroff use Eagle products every day.
The Eagle crankshafts definitely have looser tolerances than say a Callies or Bryant but they also cost a third as much as well. I've used over 250 LS1 Eagle cranks at this point with no returns of any kind on the engines I have built. Even Wormboy's 7 second LS1 engine still has an Eagle crank. If you are checking and setting bearing clearances you'll never have a problem.
Saying all that I also love the Callies Products and their rods and cranks are extremely nice and the cranks are certainly more machined and ultra consistent but they are substantially more money. Soon Callies will have even another entry level crank even more affordable though. Like in anything if you have the money and you want the best buy the Callies and if you are on more of a budget go with the Eagle parts. If a real machinist puts them together he will see anything wrong anyway.
We've used regular SBC Eagle rods even in many 1000 plus HP engines. The LS1 specific on center rod (625g) however is a medium weight and is probably not quite as strong as the normal heavier SBC rods (670g). Both can be used in an LS1 depending on setup and pistons. Tons of very reputable shops from World Products to Roush to Shafiroff use Eagle products every day.
The Eagle crankshafts definitely have looser tolerances than say a Callies or Bryant but they also cost a third as much as well. I've used over 250 LS1 Eagle cranks at this point with no returns of any kind on the engines I have built. Even Wormboy's 7 second LS1 engine still has an Eagle crank. If you are checking and setting bearing clearances you'll never have a problem.
Saying all that I also love the Callies Products and their rods and cranks are extremely nice and the cranks are certainly more machined and ultra consistent but they are substantially more money. Soon Callies will have even another entry level crank even more affordable though. Like in anything if you have the money and you want the best buy the Callies and if you are on more of a budget go with the Eagle parts. If a real machinist puts them together he will see anything wrong anyway.
10-22-2006, 10:08 AM
#7
FormerVendor
Originally Posted by machinistone
Manley is far superior to Eagle in material and machining. Just because they both say "4340" does not make them equal, try drilling on a chinese crank and then compare it to an american Crower or Bryant crank...the chinese junk cuts like butter and is very soft in comparison. The tolerances I have seen on eagle stuff is all over the place, +/- .007 on rod sizing, .002 taper across journals, etc...I have never sold eagle products, and only touch them when a customer brings them to me asking why his crank will not turn or when it exploded at 7500rpm on the backside of turn 2 and now needs a good motor.
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10-22-2006, 10:40 AM
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Erik, pm me with a price on an eagle crank please!! also, i hear you are bringing Wes' motor up to fort worth this week...think you could bring my block/crank with you when you come and i can meet you wherever you take his motor? thanks
Matt
Matt
10-22-2006, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by racer7088
I would say the Eagles can take anything you can throw their way and unlike machinistone I have used tons of Eagle rods and nothing is farther from the truth about their quality. The Eagle connecting rods are within a ten thousandth or two on size between each other almost everytime in any set and they are also very very round every time. I've used almost every rod made for LS1s and the SBC and the Eagles are very nice.
We've used regular SBC Eagle rods even in many 1000 plus HP engines. The LS1 specific on center rod (625g) however is a medium weight and is probably not quite as strong as the normal heavier SBC rods (670g). Both can be used in an LS1 depending on setup and pistons. Tons of very reputable shops from World Products to Roush to Shafiroff use Eagle products every day.
The Eagle crankshafts definitely have looser tolerances than say a Callies or Bryant but they also cost a third as much as well. I've used over 250 LS1 Eagle cranks at this point with no returns of any kind on the engines I have built. Even Wormboy's 7 second LS1 engine still has an Eagle crank. If you are checking and setting bearing clearances you'll never have a problem.
Saying all that I also love the Callies Products and their rods and cranks are extremely nice and the cranks are certainly more machined and ultra consistent but they are substantially more money. Soon Callies will have even another entry level crank even more affordable though. Like in anything if you have the money and you want the best buy the Callies and if you are on more of a budget go with the Eagle parts. If a real machinist puts them together he will see anything wrong anyway.
We've used regular SBC Eagle rods even in many 1000 plus HP engines. The LS1 specific on center rod (625g) however is a medium weight and is probably not quite as strong as the normal heavier SBC rods (670g). Both can be used in an LS1 depending on setup and pistons. Tons of very reputable shops from World Products to Roush to Shafiroff use Eagle products every day.
The Eagle crankshafts definitely have looser tolerances than say a Callies or Bryant but they also cost a third as much as well. I've used over 250 LS1 Eagle cranks at this point with no returns of any kind on the engines I have built. Even Wormboy's 7 second LS1 engine still has an Eagle crank. If you are checking and setting bearing clearances you'll never have a problem.
Saying all that I also love the Callies Products and their rods and cranks are extremely nice and the cranks are certainly more machined and ultra consistent but they are substantially more money. Soon Callies will have even another entry level crank even more affordable though. Like in anything if you have the money and you want the best buy the Callies and if you are on more of a budget go with the Eagle parts. If a real machinist puts them together he will see anything wrong anyway.
10-22-2006, 11:53 PM
#11
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I would use the ARP2000s or L19s if you thought you really needed outrageous safty margin maybe but these rods already use huge 7/16 cap screws so you probably do not need them really. These are the same bolts that come on the much larger and heavier BBC rods so they are somewhat overkill on a small block but hey it never hurts.
10-22-2006, 11:58 PM
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The L19 option is a great gaurantee to not worry about them even in up to a 1000-1200 hp application...
I know many turbo mustang guys that have made over 1000 rwhp on eagle h-beams. If your putting that much money to go that fast, L19 bolt upgrade is nothing cost wise.
I know many turbo mustang guys that have made over 1000 rwhp on eagle h-beams. If your putting that much money to go that fast, L19 bolt upgrade is nothing cost wise.
11-05-2006, 08:35 PM
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Im not sure I get your question Kurt.....but if it relates to the power the rod can hold.
I've "heard" of the standard bolts failing in some turbo mustang guys 8 sec rides spinning 8000+ rpm in 306" motors etc.. But I have never heard of a L19 bolt failing in the same applications.... I personally have them in a 1k hp 422" LS1 motor and no problem.
I've "heard" of the standard bolts failing in some turbo mustang guys 8 sec rides spinning 8000+ rpm in 306" motors etc.. But I have never heard of a L19 bolt failing in the same applications.... I personally have them in a 1k hp 422" LS1 motor and no problem.
11-05-2006, 09:46 PM
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I have always picked bolts based on the engines intended use, but HP is not a factor in our choices. We pick a bolt based first on piston/rod weight and RPM. Second consideration is engine use, a high load nitrous engine would get premium bolts because the owner will be in the engine changing pistons and the higher grade ARP stuff is better in that situation (frequent re-torque). In my opionion, a daily driver hyd cam turbo LS engine does not require a special bolt unless the piston is extremely heavy.
It is interesting to see what reasons people use the parts they use, it makes the internet one of my favorite pastimes.
Kurt
It is interesting to see what reasons people use the parts they use, it makes the internet one of my favorite pastimes.
Kurt
11-06-2006, 12:09 PM
#17
FormerVendor
Yeah the standard huge ARP 7/16 cap srews are already overkill for these small block parts in general but some people like crazy overkill. It certainly won't hurt anything.
11-06-2006, 07:13 PM
#19
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Yes,
BUt that's alright in my book. If you are trying to go ultra lightweight most will not run the huge 7/16 bolts ever but will run good 3/8 bolts like in all out 10K drag race engines and Nextel cup engines. It probably started out as a marketing deal with Eagle and then the rest do it too so they won't be smaller!
BUt that's alright in my book. If you are trying to go ultra lightweight most will not run the huge 7/16 bolts ever but will run good 3/8 bolts like in all out 10K drag race engines and Nextel cup engines. It probably started out as a marketing deal with Eagle and then the rest do it too so they won't be smaller!
Originally Posted by skipperbisket
so Erik, you think the 8740 rod bolts that come in the eagle ESP rods from the manufacturer are overkill?
11-06-2006, 08:45 PM
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ahh, i was going to upgrade to the ARP2000 bolts instead of the ones that come in the Eagle rods, but if you think those will suffice i'll just stick with those. btw, sending you an email later on about the school.