School me on big cubic inch LSx builds
10-12-2020, 06:23 AM
#1
School me on big cubic inch LSx builds Ok, so im looking into some options for a rebuild using my RHS standard deck block. Im aware there are some myths and beliefs about rotating assembly architecture, stroker longevity, etc. IIRC, my standard deck RHS block can go out to a 460ci monster. So right off the bat, im already considering a 454ci build. Itd be nice to reuse my block, cross ram intake, and possibly even my Mast ls7 285cc heads. Assuming nothing major is damaged. I want all the guts out of this existing 427ci build. Its plagued with issues and imho is a real pos. Im not placing blame nor do I care about just fixing it and dropping it back in. If it has to be disassembled and gone thru, i ll take more cubes please and want hp figures backed up on an engine dyno.
My plan is to call Golen engines today and see what they say. I ll prolly also call up HPR. Golen seems to like using RHS blocks, Mast heads, and even my Performance Design XR LS7 intake manifold on past builds.
My plan is to call Golen engines today and see what they say. I ll prolly also call up HPR. Golen seems to like using RHS blocks, Mast heads, and even my Performance Design XR LS7 intake manifold on past builds.
10-12-2020, 06:40 AM
#2
Ok, so im looking into some options for a rebuild using my RHS standard deck block. Im aware there are some myths and beliefs about rotating assembly architecture, stroker longevity, etc. IIRC, my standard deck RHS block can go out to a 460ci monster. So right off the bat, im already considering a 454ci build. Itd be nice to reuse my block, cross ram intake, and possibly even my Mast ls7 285cc heads. Assuming nothing major is damaged. I want all the guts out of this existing 427ci build. Its plagued with issues and imho is a real pos. Im not placing blame nor do I care about just fixing it and dropping it back in. If it has to be disassembled and gone thru, i ll take more cubes please and want hp figures backed up on an engine dyno.
My plan is to call Golen engines today and see what they say. I ll prolly also call up HPR. Golen seems to like using RHS blocks, Mast heads, and even my Performance Design XR LS7 intake manifold on past builds.
My plan is to call Golen engines today and see what they say. I ll prolly also call up HPR. Golen seems to like using RHS blocks, Mast heads, and even my Performance Design XR LS7 intake manifold on past builds.
Is this 427 engine utilising a GM LS7 block?
10-12-2020, 07:08 AM
#3
10 Second Club
He had a RHS 427 bort. Thats why he is wanting to reuse that block
10-12-2020, 07:17 AM
#4
10 Second Club
Sorry to hear about your motor man. All things considered a 454 in that little Chevy II would just be flat out nuts if you could get the power down! Wishing you the best and looking forward to seeing it come together.
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rkupon1 (10-12-2020)
10-12-2020, 08:53 AM
#5
I just re read your thread with your 427.
You are right.
It was just issue after issue.
Sometimes it's just better to start again.
Like I did with mine and the result so far is great.
If you are keeping it NA why don't you do a 440 like Darth did?
Keep the same stroke but enlarge the bore which should work even better with the current heads you have.
Would you say the builder botched your current engine?
You are right.
It was just issue after issue.
Sometimes it's just better to start again.
Like I did with mine and the result so far is great.
If you are keeping it NA why don't you do a 440 like Darth did?
Keep the same stroke but enlarge the bore which should work even better with the current heads you have.
Would you say the builder botched your current engine?
10-12-2020, 10:52 AM
#6
On The Tree
Ok, so im looking into some options for a rebuild using my RHS standard deck block. Im aware there are some myths and beliefs about rotating assembly architecture, stroker longevity, etc. IIRC, my standard deck RHS block can go out to a 460ci monster. So right off the bat, im already considering a 454ci build. Itd be nice to reuse my block, cross ram intake, and possibly even my Mast ls7 285cc heads. Assuming nothing major is damaged. I want all the guts out of this existing 427ci build. Its plagued with issues and imho is a real pos. Im not placing blame nor do I care about just fixing it and dropping it back in. If it has to be disassembled and gone thru, i ll take more cubes please and want hp figures backed up on an engine dyno.
My plan is to call Golen engines today and see what they say. I ll prolly also call up HPR. Golen seems to like using RHS blocks, Mast heads, and even my Performance Design XR LS7 intake manifold on past builds.
My plan is to call Golen engines today and see what they say. I ll prolly also call up HPR. Golen seems to like using RHS blocks, Mast heads, and even my Performance Design XR LS7 intake manifold on past builds.
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KCS (10-14-2020), lazerlemonta (10-12-2020)
10-12-2020, 01:42 PM
#7
Before making firm plans I think you need to really figure out where the water is coming from. You might find that you want nothing to do with this block. Then you're really back to the drawing board.
That said, 454 or 468 would be awesome. 427, 440...anything really man. You don't need to reinvent the wheel at this point you just need a new bottom end.
Don't judge performance of your last combo at all by what has been done up to this point. It clearly has never been okay.
That said, 454 or 468 would be awesome. 427, 440...anything really man. You don't need to reinvent the wheel at this point you just need a new bottom end.
Don't judge performance of your last combo at all by what has been done up to this point. It clearly has never been okay.
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10-12-2020, 03:28 PM
#9
Call my engine builder and get the right advice the first time. His level of work speaks for itself and all machine work is performed in house. And from a convenience perspective you can't beat the fact he's literally 1/2hr from where you live. If you want me to reach out to him and connect you two I will. I hate seeing good money gone bad due to a troubled build.
Last edited by cdubbzz; 10-12-2020 at 03:37 PM.
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AINT SKEERED (10-12-2020), lazerlemonta (10-12-2020)
10-12-2020, 05:10 PM
#11
I just re read your thread with your 427.
You are right.
It was just issue after issue.
Sometimes it's just better to start again.
Like I did with mine and the result so far is great.
If you are keeping it NA why don't you do a 440 like Darth did?
Keep the same stroke but enlarge the bore which should work even better with the current heads you have.
Would you say the builder botched your current engine?
You are right.
It was just issue after issue.
Sometimes it's just better to start again.
Like I did with mine and the result so far is great.
If you are keeping it NA why don't you do a 440 like Darth did?
Keep the same stroke but enlarge the bore which should work even better with the current heads you have.
Would you say the builder botched your current engine?
Before making firm plans I think you need to really figure out where the water is coming from. You might find that you want nothing to do with this block. Then you're really back to the drawing board.
That said, 454 or 468 would be awesome. 427, 440...anything really man. You don't need to reinvent the wheel at this point you just need a new bottom end.
Don't judge performance of your last combo at all by what has been done up to this point. It clearly has never been okay.
That said, 454 or 468 would be awesome. 427, 440...anything really man. You don't need to reinvent the wheel at this point you just need a new bottom end.
Don't judge performance of your last combo at all by what has been done up to this point. It clearly has never been okay.
Assuming nothing major is hurt, Id still like to re use my block, heads, and intake manifold. Im married to them from cost and lack of any real resale value. I could not care less about internals, bearings, yada yada yada. I do not trust this motor anymore and refuse to invest an ounce of energy into it unless its a complete teardown. I wanna know for sure parts I paid for are in there and what actually failed and caused everything. I must know. I want an unbiased professional opinion. From there we can determine what cards I have to play. I have 22k tied up into it not counting the intake mani. I did not cheap out. I took advice of a professional. He missed the mark. Had this motor been thrown on an engine dyno from jump, it still would have failed imho. It was broken the day we fired it up. I ll bet the ranch! My rebuild, teardown, etc will be built with expectations this go around. If that means rolling with another companies program than so be it. I want the engine dyno'd prior to leaving the facility so theres no speculation. Straight facts!
Now that part is over with, I spoke with Chad Golen of Golen Race Engines in NH today. I chose him to call first today because his web page is the reason i fell in love with this intake. I saw it on a dyno video they posted. Golen engines likes to use RHS blocks, Mast cylinder heads, and even this intake mani. They built motors like this before. Seemed like a good place to start. He spent quite a bit of time with me on the phone today. First step is going to be pull the motor out from the car and deliver it to him. Tear down and inspect whats good, whats not, what he d use, what he never would have used. Than we are going to discuss a plan, options, and prices from there. He talked me out of ordering a fresh LS7 440ci build on a whim today. Said bring it up here n lets go thru it first. Than he talked me out of bigger cubes-440ci or 454ci. He said there is simply no need for my power goals given some of the parts I already own. I cant imagine he ll wanna re use everything. He said he can make 720-730hp on this motor in his sleep with a very streetable hydraulic roller, 11.5:1 compression, 92 oct. I said if you ll back that up on an engine dyno, im in! The curve never lies! I know 7xx sounds great, but after all the brass tax, prolly more like 550rwhp. Meh! Its 2020, if im droppin coin on a build like this, I wanna see something! I hope block and heads are fine, if not i cant see how im not gunna go with a 440ci or 468ci build.
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10-12-2020, 08:14 PM
#12
Sounds about right given what your asking for hp and cubic inches....all builders listed could do what your asking 👍😉
10-12-2020, 08:50 PM
#13
Im done speculating. This motor was damaged goods the moment we started it up. It was not the tune, bad muffler bearings, or lack of horn oil. I moved slow and methodical on this car and the motor, constantly fighting with it. Fix one motor issue, discover another same day. All this drama from a head n cam NA motor? I dunno who or what is to blame. Im done guessing, been getting egg on my face since June. I believe in engine failures, there are no coincidences. Everything is cause and effect. These issues are all related somehow. I did my part the whole way. I own the motor, its mine, and on me regardless at this point. Done crying over it.
I wasnt gunna throw this one in the garbage. I was just gunna order a new one to save time and headaches so i can cruise someday. And put this one on a stand to revisit it, sell, or part out someday when I felt like it. Im disgusted with it and not really interested in it as of right now. Especially bcuz at a moments notice, it can simply be worse than I know. Theres so much stuff that happened behind scenes like this, it doesnt all make it into text. Just disappointment.
Assuming nothing major is hurt, Id still like to re use my block, heads, and intake manifold. Im married to them from cost and lack of any real resale value. I could not care less about internals, bearings, yada yada yada. I do not trust this motor anymore and refuse to invest an ounce of energy into it unless its a complete teardown. I wanna know for sure parts I paid for are in there and what actually failed and caused everything. I must know. I want an unbiased professional opinion. From there we can determine what cards I have to play. I have 22k tied up into it not counting the intake mani. I did not cheap out. I took advice of a professional. He missed the mark. Had this motor been thrown on an engine dyno from jump, it still would have failed imho. It was broken the day we fired it up. I ll bet the ranch! My rebuild, teardown, etc will be built with expectations this go around. If that means rolling with another companies program than so be it. I want the engine dyno'd prior to leaving the facility so theres no speculation. Straight facts!
Now that part is over with, I spoke with Chad Golen of Golen Race Engines in NH today. I chose him to call first today because his web page is the reason i fell in love with this intake. I saw it on a dyno video they posted. Golen engines likes to use RHS blocks, Mast cylinder heads, and even this intake mani. They built motors like this before. Seemed like a good place to start. He spent quite a bit of time with me on the phone today. First step is going to be pull the motor out from the car and deliver it to him. Tear down and inspect whats good, whats not, what he d use, what he never would have used. Than we are going to discuss a plan, options, and prices from there. He talked me out of ordering a fresh LS7 440ci build on a whim today. Said bring it up here n lets go thru it first. Than he talked me out of bigger cubes-440ci or 454ci. He said there is simply no need for my power goals given some of the parts I already own. I cant imagine he ll wanna re use everything. He said he can make 720-730hp on this motor in his sleep with a very streetable hydraulic roller, 11.5:1 compression, 92 oct. I said if you ll back that up on an engine dyno, im in! The curve never lies! I know 7xx sounds great, but after all the brass tax, prolly more like 550rwhp. Meh! Its 2020, if im droppin coin on a build like this, I wanna see something! I hope block and heads are fine, if not i cant see how im not gunna go with a 440ci or 468ci build.
I wasnt gunna throw this one in the garbage. I was just gunna order a new one to save time and headaches so i can cruise someday. And put this one on a stand to revisit it, sell, or part out someday when I felt like it. Im disgusted with it and not really interested in it as of right now. Especially bcuz at a moments notice, it can simply be worse than I know. Theres so much stuff that happened behind scenes like this, it doesnt all make it into text. Just disappointment.
Assuming nothing major is hurt, Id still like to re use my block, heads, and intake manifold. Im married to them from cost and lack of any real resale value. I could not care less about internals, bearings, yada yada yada. I do not trust this motor anymore and refuse to invest an ounce of energy into it unless its a complete teardown. I wanna know for sure parts I paid for are in there and what actually failed and caused everything. I must know. I want an unbiased professional opinion. From there we can determine what cards I have to play. I have 22k tied up into it not counting the intake mani. I did not cheap out. I took advice of a professional. He missed the mark. Had this motor been thrown on an engine dyno from jump, it still would have failed imho. It was broken the day we fired it up. I ll bet the ranch! My rebuild, teardown, etc will be built with expectations this go around. If that means rolling with another companies program than so be it. I want the engine dyno'd prior to leaving the facility so theres no speculation. Straight facts!
Now that part is over with, I spoke with Chad Golen of Golen Race Engines in NH today. I chose him to call first today because his web page is the reason i fell in love with this intake. I saw it on a dyno video they posted. Golen engines likes to use RHS blocks, Mast cylinder heads, and even this intake mani. They built motors like this before. Seemed like a good place to start. He spent quite a bit of time with me on the phone today. First step is going to be pull the motor out from the car and deliver it to him. Tear down and inspect whats good, whats not, what he d use, what he never would have used. Than we are going to discuss a plan, options, and prices from there. He talked me out of ordering a fresh LS7 440ci build on a whim today. Said bring it up here n lets go thru it first. Than he talked me out of bigger cubes-440ci or 454ci. He said there is simply no need for my power goals given some of the parts I already own. I cant imagine he ll wanna re use everything. He said he can make 720-730hp on this motor in his sleep with a very streetable hydraulic roller, 11.5:1 compression, 92 oct. I said if you ll back that up on an engine dyno, im in! The curve never lies! I know 7xx sounds great, but after all the brass tax, prolly more like 550rwhp. Meh! Its 2020, if im droppin coin on a build like this, I wanna see something! I hope block and heads are fine, if not i cant see how im not gunna go with a 440ci or 468ci build.
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rkupon1 (10-13-2020)
10-12-2020, 09:11 PM
#14
Y not a 468 that block can be clearance for a 4.25 crank go big or go home. I builded a 450 RHS block I wish I would have when bigger.now the time
Last edited by Last 1; 10-12-2020 at 09:34 PM.
10-12-2020, 09:55 PM
#15
So a change in pistons & crank with a block that the sleeve's don't go above 4.155 warrant all this for 725 fwhp... Fake news. Over build 👎 for the sake to say you got XXX amount of cubic inches? When he has everything 😒🤨🤔.
10-13-2020, 04:40 AM
#16
I still want more cubes, but if they say I can meet or exceed my power goals without struggling with the parts theme im using, than 427ci it is. I just feel once bitten twice shy and dont believe a damn thing. I feel if the motor has to come apart, nows the time sorta thing. Im not running a carbed tunnel ram set up. However, my intake is not restrictive as some in these higher end builds. Chad Golen reaffirmed this to me, and is a huge fan of it. Which is good, because Im no doubt stuck with it. And as far as 550-600whp being "plenty", "handful", "too much", for a street car. Save all that, bcuz forums like this wouldnt exist. These are factory sports car numbers nowadays. It s nothing anymore. Its just the way. So wanting a 750hp NA motor on pumpgas isnt an unreasonable request. I ll settle for the 720-730 promised with a 427. But i still think if he plans on ditching my rotating assembly, than now is the time for more. A 440ci cost same as a 427ci. Just sayin...
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AINT SKEERED (10-13-2020)
10-13-2020, 04:47 AM
#17
I still want more cubes, but if they say I can meet or exceed my power goals without struggling with the parts theme im using, than 427ci it is. I just feel once bitten twice shy and dont believe a damn thing. I feel if the motor has to come apart, nows the time sorta thing. Im not running a carbed tunnel ram set up. However, my intake is not restrictive as some in these higher end builds. Chad Golen reaffirmed this to me, and is a huge fan of it. Which is good, because Im no doubt stuck with it. And as far as 550-600whp being "plenty", "handful", "too much", for a street car. Save all that, bcuz forums like this wouldnt exist. These are factory sports car numbers nowadays. It s nothing anymore. Its just the way. So wanting a 750hp NA motor on pumpgas isnt an unreasonable request. I ll settle for the 720-730 promised with a 427. But i still think if he plans on ditching my rotating assembly, than now is the time for more. A 440ci cost same as a 427ci. Just sayin...
I'd do the same thing .when I rebuild again im going bigger as well. But mine was nasty at 670 fwhp at 3900 lbs, my new set up should be close to 100 more and I can only imagine the sudden loss of traction you are about to be in for.😁
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rkupon1 (10-13-2020)
10-13-2020, 05:58 AM
#20
750 hp with a 427...So funny but you need more cubes .... Added anything in the short block typically can be fixed including crank maybe not pistons...If you've got 💰 to burn feel free... 440 - 468ci for 750 hp LMAO 🤣😆😉. Darth was after the numbers of John B ....