Super-Bat

iTrader: (38)

Something new has started to bug me.
For all of you stick shift familiar drivers... Ya know how say when stopped at a light, or on an incline, you can let out the clutch like half way, or just enough to keep you from rolling back? Or, if you're on a flat surface, you can even creep forward a bit without touching the gas pedal? This is an easy way to start as well, w/o being a noob and either stalling out, bogging the engine, or over revving in first. Anyway, this is what I usually do.
Lately, I've noticed a vibration in the car that seems to escalate the longer I have the clutch pedal in this position. Oh, and I think it's more likely to happen if I'm holding the brake pedal as well. It's like the transmission is shuddering like crazy. Even the stick shift starts to move a bit. I can put in the clutch all the way, and start to let it out slowly, and it'll either do it again, or not do it. This only happens every now and then, but it seems kinda scary. The RPMs don't drop, and nothing on the gauge cluster seems to fluctuate any, so idk what the deal is.
Any ideas guys?

2000 Firebird 3.8L

calhoon

iTrader: (6)

Are you new at this? This is called clutch chatter and is the result of slipping the clutch....which is what you are doing. You can limit the affect by letting the clutch out quicker but if you are "holding" the car this way, you are slipping the clutch the whole time.

eseibel67

iTrader: (10)

Clutch should engage smoothly, even if you let it out sans throttle.

Some things that could cause shuddering:

Overheated clutch (weakened cushion springs in disc or hot spots on pressure plate/flywheel).

Oil on disc.

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

You are experiencing chatter that results from the clutch being held at its engagement point longer than necessary. Doing this allows the clutch to slip excessively and thus is not recommended. This can lead to much faster wear and in the process can generate massive amounts of heat. This phenomenon is most common with new drivers as they use the engagement point to hold the car in place allowing them to get off the brake and onto the gas without rolling backwards. My suggestion is to stop now before you need an untimely clutch job! Of course, if you do need a clutch give me a shout and I would be happy to assist you. Thanks in advance. I hope this info helps.

Super-Bat

iTrader: (38)

Thank you for all the responses! I am quite new at this, as this car is my first stick shift. Cant believe I was such a n00b. Could it be I've already screwed up my clutch?? Even if I have the clutch at its engagement point AND have the brake compressed I could still hurt it?
Ugh...
How much does a new clutch usually run? I doubt I can afford anything like this... sucks being a college student with limited income...
I need to lrn2drive! haha.

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

Bat, No worries at all. That is what we are here to do, assisting folks like yourself with questions and product info. It is possible that damage has already occured but this doesn't mean that you clutch is shot. Just try not to use the clutch to hold the car in the future to avoid any greater wear. Even using the brake while doing this isn't good. Remember you are effectively causing your clutch to slip which in turn causes wear.

I have provided a link to our web site with info relative to the clutches for your vehicle. You can find pricing, capacity, and options on the linked page. If you have any questions you cal always post here or contact be by phone or email.

http://www.specclutch.com/cars/Ponti...Am/2000/Single

Thanks and have a great weekend!

A_Cool_Name

Read:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-tr...must-read.html



You said your new to lsx stuff.........avoid the noob mistake of buying a SPEC clutch

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

As anyone that frequents any automotive forum realizes you can positive and negative reviews for any product or company. With over 19,000 LS based clutch kits sold to date I think the numbers speak for themselves. Though I understand that no company will ever make every customer happy every time we do our best to provide great products and a great price with service that is second to none. If you have any further questions let me know. And cool, if you feel that you have been somehow shorted by us in the past I will be happy to discuss any concerns you have as well.

Arc00TA

iTrader: (17)

This question comes up regularly, seems like there is not enough people that know how to drive manual transmissions so they can pass it down properly instead of guys like OP trying to learn themselves and ruining a clutch. I only tried to hold the car on a hill with the clutch one time, and got smacked upside the head by my dad (I was 14), and told to never do it again. Lesson learned, clutch lived happily ever after. That's America for you though, 90% automatic transmissions for the lazy.

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

Arc, I can relate to that story. I learned to drive in an old Ford Bronco and realized very quickly that using the clutch to hold the car on a hill wasn't a good idea...though I wasn't smacked on the head my step-dad made it clear that doing this wasn't correct or acceptable. Of course these days most driver's ed teachers and parents are more familiar with the use of auto-tragic transmissions than manuals and as such many people never learn to drive as we did. Such is life I suppose!

A_Cool_Name

Read:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-tr...must-read.html



I haven't been very impressed with SPEC's customer service. A very abbreviated version of a conversation with them goes as follows, spec will first blame factory hydraulics are inferior (on a side note.......I've had spec clutches before with OEM hydraulics with no drill mod and you could bang gears all day long), if they can't blame hydraulics they move on to installation error (ex. you forget to install the shim, installed plate and disc improperly, or on the system not being bleed good enough. No matter what their clutch is not defective.

Super-Bat

iTrader: (38)

Thanks, I was actually checking out your site this morning before I went off to work. It's sad that these things don't run cheap. But nowadays, what part on our cars do? I really appreciate your help, and I'm sure I'll have many more questions that'll come up soon...
I am new, in fact so new, I don't even own an lsx car... as stated in the OP, my car is a sixer... Also, if you've got a problem with SPEC... what other brand would you recommend? Then I'd presume once you mention this brand, SPEC may have a rebuttal, which in fact, I wouldn't mind reading...
Yeah, self taught here. I was assisted by 2 of my friends before I bought the car. One friend let me drive his car around a parking lot (only because he was about to trade it in at a dealer) and he didn't mind running the risk of me breaking his car. The other let me practice on his truck a little before picking up the bird. He also followed me home from the dealer's lot... just in case I stalled out, no one would rearend me... haha.
I really wish I had a dad who would've smacked me upside the head and taught me how to drive stick...
But, the more I the more I learn, i suppose. Hopefully I learn to break less parts! haha.

A_Cool_Name

Read:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-tr...must-read.html



i had a ram before........that didn't last very long. have a mcleod setup now (600s disc, plate, alum. FW, and TO bearing). never tried their clutches for lsx stuff, will see how it goes.

Bad Blue WS6

iTrader: (41)

On the other side of the coin, my Spec 3 has lasted me over 25000 miles of beat the **** up, driving all crazy, abuse, and still works great. ((and im not the best clutch driver out there) Stupid launches that have broken many other parts of my car, etc, etc, but the clutch still works awesome. ((I think my TO bearing is pooping out on me, but hey,, **** happens. ))
If you look on here, you will find out that there are quite a few folks that run Spec clutches, probably more than any other company out there, and tons of great reviews too. I have never dealt with Spec's customer service, but SPEC-01 has always helped me with questions and such, so im positive that when it comes time for me to replace my clutch (another Spec 3, love that hook of doom) that i will get the service that i need.

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

Cool, It seems that you have less than positive things to say about all the clutches you have used (or at least that is the way it seems when reading your posts). You mention our reference to hydraulics, installation, and shim use as part of a "standardized" answer and as I am sure you know, all of these things play a part in clutch function and performance. These answers aren't intended to cover or divert an issue with a clutch kit, but are rather referenced to insure that the each customer with an issue has examined the usual suspects.

As any non-Newb would know, having air in the system or a poorly functioning hydraulic system will inherently affect clutch release. So too will a clutch that isn't installed properly (miss-torqued, disc in backwards, etc...); or even the lack of or inclusion of a shim when it isn't needed. This is logic right?

In the end, I think that my continued presence on this forum, where I do my very best to provide tech support and product information to all that need it (even those that don't have one of our clutches) is clear evidence of my intent to help the community at large and further supports my dedication to providing great customer service, before, during, and after your purchase. But then again...I suppose I could be wrong. Lets let those reading this decide!

Bat, if you have any questions about pricing just give me a call and we can discuss specifics.

Bad Blue, thanks for the support...Let me know when your ready for the next kit.

A_Cool_Name

Read:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-tr...must-read.html



I've had great experiences with spec in the past as well, but the last few clutches I've got from them have been junk for a lack of better vocabulary. The clutch won't allow the car to shift. I expected two fundamental things when I bought the last few clutches from spec 1. for the clutches to work and 2. if they don't work for SPEC to make the situation right. Neither of which has happened yet. I've been very disappointed with their customer service about arriving at a real solution, all I want is a clutch that works is that to much to ask for?

A_Cool_Name

Read:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/manual-tr...must-read.html




For what its worth........I had a SPEC dealer bleed the hydraulics after I had done it multiple times. dealer said the bleed was good and that the clutch would not disengage at high rpm, SPEC told that dealer to do the drill mod. I don't have a problem with all clutches, just the ones that don't work. The ram worked it just didn't last very long, about 8,000 miles. I don't have a problem with spec's standardized answer, but it is frustrating when that standard answer is all that is being focused on

ttranssam

iTrader: (10)

when a spec is installed the correct way....it works fine. just because they give you a shim does not mean use it. i destroyed a spec by installing it incorrectly and that sob still lasted 7500, im now moving on to my second spec 3...regular...and am going to prove to everybody that it will last when you know what your doing, hey A COOL NAME, you would **** your self if you knew how many spec's are installed in cars at big name shops each year...ppl just dont have problems so you only hear the ones that bitch that it broke...

Super-Bat

iTrader: (38)

What kind of clutch would be recommended for a 5 speed, daily driver, never sees track time, and still kind of a n00b at driving? I've gotten so used to the feel of the stock clutch, and I must say I like it... but I want something that can take the abuse of my newb driving and live long. I am working on my driving habits, but it's hard to break bad habits, haha.

Also, what all needs to be replaced, just the clutch? I've read that a few other parts need to be replaced as well...
This is going to add up to be pricey as hell! lol

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

Cool, any time that there is an issue with one of our units we will provide an RMA and thus allowthe user to send the unit in to us for assessment. You seem convinced that this is a clutch issue but have you ever sent the unit in question back to us for assessment. Have you ever compared the stack height of your unit to the expected height for our LS1 assemblies? Have you ever called me directly to discuss your issues? Again, I am happy to assist you but at this point it is clear that you have to be willing to help me help you and that doesn't really seem like something your interested in. If you ever are let me know.

Bat, I think you would be a great candidate for our stage 1. This unit uses an upgraded organic disc material and one of our built pressure-plates. This allows the kit to provide a higher torque capacity and maintains great street manners. Let me know if you are interested and I will be happy to assist you. My number and email are listed below. Thanks,