Fabulous Brakes, Much Less than Baer, etc.
11-07-2003, 06:51 PM
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Fabulous Brakes, Much Less $ than Baer, etc. To build my '94 Z28 Road Racer, I wanted Brakes that were far superior to the stock ones.
The After-Market kits available are just too EXPENSIVE.
I couldn't upgrade to 1LE because of the class my car is in.
So, with a little ingenuity, and work.... tada.... Brakes AWESOME all day long.
Cut the cast iron "ears" off. This allows for 13" rotors.
Buy Wilwood Superlite II calipers. $200 CDN each.
Buy Corvette ZR1 13"x1.12" rotors. $185 CDN each.
Fabricate adapter plate to mount to original mounting holes, and bolt caliper to it. $10 CDN each. (need 1 for each side)
Install Wilwood brake pads. $165 CDN a full front set.
I use "Black"s, but this is for road racing. You could get a less aggressive pad for the street/strip.
Install Stainless Steel braided lines. Don't count this in this package price. $100 CDN.
Use a good synthetic Brake Fluid. I use Motul 600. Don't count this in this package price. $13 CDN per liter.
Use stock rotors with Hawk HP+ pads on the rears.
This thing stops like CRAZY.... all day long. No fade, no soft pedal.
I can show pictures of the whole process, and am willing to talk to anyone interested in pursuing this route.
Much cheaper.... about $1000 CDN.
The After-Market kits available are just too EXPENSIVE.
I couldn't upgrade to 1LE because of the class my car is in.
So, with a little ingenuity, and work.... tada.... Brakes AWESOME all day long.
Cut the cast iron "ears" off. This allows for 13" rotors.
Buy Wilwood Superlite II calipers. $200 CDN each.
Buy Corvette ZR1 13"x1.12" rotors. $185 CDN each.
Fabricate adapter plate to mount to original mounting holes, and bolt caliper to it. $10 CDN each. (need 1 for each side)
Install Wilwood brake pads. $165 CDN a full front set.
I use "Black"s, but this is for road racing. You could get a less aggressive pad for the street/strip.
Install Stainless Steel braided lines. Don't count this in this package price. $100 CDN.
Use a good synthetic Brake Fluid. I use Motul 600. Don't count this in this package price. $13 CDN per liter.
Use stock rotors with Hawk HP+ pads on the rears.
This thing stops like CRAZY.... all day long. No fade, no soft pedal.
I can show pictures of the whole process, and am willing to talk to anyone interested in pursuing this route.
Much cheaper.... about $1000 CDN.
Last edited by ntmd8r; 11-07-2003 at 07:30 PM.
11-08-2003, 04:04 PM
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Richmond, BC (just outside Vancouver... a bit closer to the border).
BTW, I did forget to mention 1 thing.....
Of course, with 13" rotors, 16" wheels just won't fit.
I am running ZR1 17x9.5 rims, which fit and clear perfectly... no spacers or nuthin'.
BTW, I did forget to mention 1 thing.....
Of course, with 13" rotors, 16" wheels just won't fit.
I am running ZR1 17x9.5 rims, which fit and clear perfectly... no spacers or nuthin'.
11-08-2003, 10:26 PM
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Sure....
Wilwood Superlite II Calipers
120-3191 L/H
120-3191 R/H
Corvette ZR1 rotors. I got them from NAPA, so these numbers may not mean anything
Left 86494
Right 86495
Wilwood "black" pads 15A-5735K
You might want to get something a little less aggressive for the street/strip.
I did use the stock rear rotors and calipers, and Hawk HP+ pads
I believe in using GOOD brake fluid.
The best is Castrol SRF. Very pricey.... your first and last born for each liter/quart.
2nd is MOTUL600. About $13CDN per. This is what I use in all my vehicles.
3rd is the Ford stuff. Don't know the code or price. But for the average street/strip guy, it is probably the least expensive, and requires changing less often. It is much less hygroscopic than all the rest.
Wilwood also makes Wilwood575 and Wilwood600.
I tried the 575, but it wasn't nearly as good as the MOTUL600.
For those who are SERIOUS racers, I also installed Wilwood Thermlock Pistons in the calipers. These reduce the heat transfer from the pads/rotors to the brake fluid by up to 50%.
They are COSTLY..... $40US each. Part number 200-7551.
I found that before I installed them, I was bleeding brakes after every race weekend. After installing them, I didn't have to bleed at all between weekends. I only did it when I changed pads (3 weekends).
You might also want to install a Brake Bias spring. It goes in the Master Cylinder.
Typicall, your braking bias front/rears is about 70/30. This little spring changes it to more like about 60/40. Not a lot, but every little bit helps.
These springs are available from any after-market place.... around $20.
Pictures.....
Cutoff the ears
Rotor and Caliper just tried on... notice the old caliper and brake line sitting on the tire... and notice the caliper is actually upside down. We were just trying it to see how it would fit/look.
Right Front Finished
Sorry.... I don't have any pictures of the adapter, or how it looks. Just didn't think about it when I was taking pictures during the build.
But here is a photo I just altered with a little line drawing of where/how the adapter plate looks. Of course, the adapter fits BEHIND the cast iron legs, but yoiu can get the idea.
The adapter plate we fabricated uses the factory mounting holes (this is how I followed the rules), and then has 2 other holes in it to mount the caliper.
I can't remember if we used the factory bolts to bolt the adapter plate, or got a couple of other ones. Then we bolted the caliper to the adapter plate using the 2 new holes. We used bolts which have little holes in the heads, and used "safety" wire to keep them from turning.
The new holes in the adapter for the calipers are a little bit wider and further out than the factory holes. They are drilled to match up to the calipers mounting holes.
Wilwood Superlite II Calipers
120-3191 L/H
120-3191 R/H
Corvette ZR1 rotors. I got them from NAPA, so these numbers may not mean anything
Left 86494
Right 86495
Wilwood "black" pads 15A-5735K
You might want to get something a little less aggressive for the street/strip.
I did use the stock rear rotors and calipers, and Hawk HP+ pads
I believe in using GOOD brake fluid.
The best is Castrol SRF. Very pricey.... your first and last born for each liter/quart.
2nd is MOTUL600. About $13CDN per. This is what I use in all my vehicles.
3rd is the Ford stuff. Don't know the code or price. But for the average street/strip guy, it is probably the least expensive, and requires changing less often. It is much less hygroscopic than all the rest.
Wilwood also makes Wilwood575 and Wilwood600.
I tried the 575, but it wasn't nearly as good as the MOTUL600.
For those who are SERIOUS racers, I also installed Wilwood Thermlock Pistons in the calipers. These reduce the heat transfer from the pads/rotors to the brake fluid by up to 50%.
They are COSTLY..... $40US each. Part number 200-7551.
I found that before I installed them, I was bleeding brakes after every race weekend. After installing them, I didn't have to bleed at all between weekends. I only did it when I changed pads (3 weekends).
You might also want to install a Brake Bias spring. It goes in the Master Cylinder.
Typicall, your braking bias front/rears is about 70/30. This little spring changes it to more like about 60/40. Not a lot, but every little bit helps.
These springs are available from any after-market place.... around $20.
Pictures.....
Cutoff the ears
Rotor and Caliper just tried on... notice the old caliper and brake line sitting on the tire... and notice the caliper is actually upside down. We were just trying it to see how it would fit/look.
Right Front Finished
Sorry.... I don't have any pictures of the adapter, or how it looks. Just didn't think about it when I was taking pictures during the build.
But here is a photo I just altered with a little line drawing of where/how the adapter plate looks. Of course, the adapter fits BEHIND the cast iron legs, but yoiu can get the idea.
The adapter plate we fabricated uses the factory mounting holes (this is how I followed the rules), and then has 2 other holes in it to mount the caliper.
I can't remember if we used the factory bolts to bolt the adapter plate, or got a couple of other ones. Then we bolted the caliper to the adapter plate using the 2 new holes. We used bolts which have little holes in the heads, and used "safety" wire to keep them from turning.
The new holes in the adapter for the calipers are a little bit wider and further out than the factory holes. They are drilled to match up to the calipers mounting holes.
Last edited by ntmd8r; 11-10-2003 at 02:45 PM.
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11-10-2003, 02:38 PM
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Xsta,
You are correct.
Within our rules, I could NOT replace the hub... this is interpreted as "upgrading". And I would have had to replace all the major components as I said earlier.
This would have literally moved the original mounting holes to a different location, and I couldn't do that.
So I used the original hub, and used the original mounting holes, and just used the adapter to mount the calipers. You see, calipers are considered as consumables which you can buy/upgrade, but hubs are not. Hubs are the original factory suspension and you can only replace with same/better. But since other components mount to them, they must NOT move/alter the original mounting points that these other components use.
They (the rules enforcers) let this go, so go figure.
You are correct.
Within our rules, I could NOT replace the hub... this is interpreted as "upgrading". And I would have had to replace all the major components as I said earlier.
This would have literally moved the original mounting holes to a different location, and I couldn't do that.
So I used the original hub, and used the original mounting holes, and just used the adapter to mount the calipers. You see, calipers are considered as consumables which you can buy/upgrade, but hubs are not. Hubs are the original factory suspension and you can only replace with same/better. But since other components mount to them, they must NOT move/alter the original mounting points that these other components use.
They (the rules enforcers) let this go, so go figure.
11-10-2003, 02:42 PM
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And....
I don't know the cost of C5 rotors and calipers (I only have 23000 km on my 2K, and haven't needed to replace anything yet (other than pads and fluid)), I don't know what a cost comparison of this approach would be versus my approach.
And.... this was for my early 4th gen... so it is for '93-'97.
Since the 98-up have different front "bits", my solution might not be as easy as replacing with the C5 stuff.
I don't know the cost of C5 rotors and calipers (I only have 23000 km on my 2K, and haven't needed to replace anything yet (other than pads and fluid)), I don't know what a cost comparison of this approach would be versus my approach.
And.... this was for my early 4th gen... so it is for '93-'97.
Since the 98-up have different front "bits", my solution might not be as easy as replacing with the C5 stuff.
11-13-2003, 01:44 AM
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Brake Comparison I was looking at your post and I am a bit intrigued. I was planning on purchasing a Wilwood 6 piston kit for my 97Z but then I started to hear things about how the Wilwood kit does not compare to the Baer 4 or 6 or even Brembo's 
. Have you tried the other kits or know anyone that has purchased them. I have recently run into a guy at CamaroZ28. com and he was promoting a Z06 brake upgrade kit that uses a LS1 spindle and OEM Z06 brake parts. Do you use your car for daily driving at all or is it strictly setup for road racing. Where did you buy the calipers from and how many times have you used them now.
My second inquiry has to do with lights that I can no longer get here in the US. As I was reading I saw a couple of you guys lived in Canada. I am trying to get ahold of a set of Catz HID lights. I have one set but I would like to get one more. In case you are wondering these things are incredible and they are like night and day once installed. I can purchase the kit but I am afraid I might run into problems when it comes time to send the lights through customs. Does anyone here happen to come across the border into the states ever. I am willing to purchase the kit and have it sent to someone if they will come into the states and send it through UPS to me. Any ways if any of you would be willing to help me I would really appreciate it. You can e-mail me at z28racn@aol.com. Ne ways nice setup.
. Have you tried the other kits or know anyone that has purchased them. I have recently run into a guy at CamaroZ28. com and he was promoting a Z06 brake upgrade kit that uses a LS1 spindle and OEM Z06 brake parts. Do you use your car for daily driving at all or is it strictly setup for road racing. Where did you buy the calipers from and how many times have you used them now. My second inquiry has to do with lights that I can no longer get here in the US. As I was reading I saw a couple of you guys lived in Canada. I am trying to get ahold of a set of Catz HID lights. I have one set but I would like to get one more. In case you are wondering these things are incredible and they are like night and day once installed. I can purchase the kit but I am afraid I might run into problems when it comes time to send the lights through customs. Does anyone here happen to come across the border into the states ever. I am willing to purchase the kit and have it sent to someone if they will come into the states and send it through UPS to me. Any ways if any of you would be willing to help me I would really appreciate it. You can e-mail me at z28racn@aol.com. Ne ways nice setup.
11-13-2003, 10:59 AM
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Midnight F117A (cool name)... NO, these Wilwoods do NOT come with dust boots.
Z28racn.
I have not tried any other kits, nor do I know anyone who has. I just went with a solution to give me AWESOME brakes at a much cheaper price than any of the "kits".
I couldn't upgrade to the LS1 spindle, I didn't think it was available for this year (93-97). If I did upgrade to the years I thought it was available, I would have had to upgrade all the suspension and running gear. See my earlier response regarding rules and upgrades.
This car is strictly for Road Racing. Not streetable in this configuration (full cage, seat belts removed/replaced with harness, no headlights, no catalytic converter).
You can see the whole history of building the car with Pictures GALORE on our Website....
Click Here
I got the calipers from a local guy up here who is a Wilwood supplier.
But Wilwood does sell direct.
I have used the car for 2 years/seasons. So.... about 18 track/race weekends.
I replace pads every 3-4 weekends, depending on the number of events I enter.
I swap the pads (swap inner/outer) after each race weekend. They tend to wear in a taper... but differently for inner and outer. The outers wear leading edge to trailing edge, the inners wear inner edge to outer edge. So I swap the pads after each weekend to even out the taper wear. I also can do a bleed at this time. Since I installed the ThermLock pistons, no bleeding is NECESSARY. Brakes do NOT go soft, nor do I lose any pedal.... during an entire race weekend.
Never heard of Catz HID lights. I do know of PIAA.
Asking someone to take something across the border nowadays is a little tough.
They pretty much examine almost everything. So to take something in a box (if they see it) is like waving a red flag in front of a bull. They will want all the "paperwork" regarding the goods (being imported, yada yada yada).
I know, because it has happened to me a couple of times.
Z28racn.
I have not tried any other kits, nor do I know anyone who has. I just went with a solution to give me AWESOME brakes at a much cheaper price than any of the "kits".
I couldn't upgrade to the LS1 spindle, I didn't think it was available for this year (93-97). If I did upgrade to the years I thought it was available, I would have had to upgrade all the suspension and running gear. See my earlier response regarding rules and upgrades.
This car is strictly for Road Racing. Not streetable in this configuration (full cage, seat belts removed/replaced with harness, no headlights, no catalytic converter).
You can see the whole history of building the car with Pictures GALORE on our Website....
Click Here
I got the calipers from a local guy up here who is a Wilwood supplier.
But Wilwood does sell direct.
I have used the car for 2 years/seasons. So.... about 18 track/race weekends.
I replace pads every 3-4 weekends, depending on the number of events I enter.
I swap the pads (swap inner/outer) after each race weekend. They tend to wear in a taper... but differently for inner and outer. The outers wear leading edge to trailing edge, the inners wear inner edge to outer edge. So I swap the pads after each weekend to even out the taper wear. I also can do a bleed at this time. Since I installed the ThermLock pistons, no bleeding is NECESSARY. Brakes do NOT go soft, nor do I lose any pedal.... during an entire race weekend.
Never heard of Catz HID lights. I do know of PIAA.
Asking someone to take something across the border nowadays is a little tough.
They pretty much examine almost everything. So to take something in a box (if they see it) is like waving a red flag in front of a bull. They will want all the "paperwork" regarding the goods (being imported, yada yada yada).
I know, because it has happened to me a couple of times.
