DOT 4 brake fade
10-22-2010, 04:12 PM
#1
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DOT 4 brake fade So I put Hawk HP+ pads on all 4 corners, totally drained out the old fluid and filled up on ATE DOT 4 fluid and bled everything good. Still have the factory calipers and rotors. After a few times around the track my pedal is mushy but the car stops ok. Not pushing it real hard since I am scared the brakes will fail. My question is - can I install stainless lines and run a DOT 5 or higher fluid? Would that help? It's a 99 WS6 M6. Want to not worry about the brakes failing at 135 mph.
Any suggestions?
Any suggestions?
10-22-2010, 04:18 PM
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HP+ pads are a little aggressive, but not for track days. I would think those pads are heating up the stock rotors really fast and that is not helping your braking, stock calipers are fine. ATE Super Blue is one of the top fluids.
10-22-2010, 04:51 PM
#4
I don't know if someone recommended those pads for track use---but if they did, they shouldn't have. You need better brake pads, and if you can better cooling too.
I wish folks would realize that I those are NOT RACE TRACK PADS.
Here's what I'd recommend.
A set of Hawk HT-10 (mimimum) front for track use: http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...=190&ModelID=7
Upgrading the brake fluid to a higher temperature fluid... I like this stuff: http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...=194&ModelID=7
And these front brake rotors which are directionally vaned and pump cooling air better than straight vaned rotors: http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...=191&ModelID=7
If you want to do stainless lines, that's fine--but do nothing to help fade.
OR, you can spend real money on a set of REAL brakes like Stoptechs for $2200 and get directional rotors @ 13" and 1.25" wide and 2-piece hats and 4 piston calipers. Though only the rotor size will help. And still not enough to make you able to run sub-par brake pads for track use.
I wish folks would realize that I those are NOT RACE TRACK PADS.
Here's what I'd recommend.
A set of Hawk HT-10 (mimimum) front for track use: http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...=190&ModelID=7
Upgrading the brake fluid to a higher temperature fluid... I like this stuff: http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...=194&ModelID=7
And these front brake rotors which are directionally vaned and pump cooling air better than straight vaned rotors: http://www.stranoparts.com/partdetai...=191&ModelID=7
If you want to do stainless lines, that's fine--but do nothing to help fade.
OR, you can spend real money on a set of REAL brakes like Stoptechs for $2200 and get directional rotors @ 13" and 1.25" wide and 2-piece hats and 4 piston calipers. Though only the rotor size will help. And still not enough to make you able to run sub-par brake pads for track use.
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10-22-2010, 05:11 PM
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Sam thanks for the reply. I talked to a guy who runs a driving school here in Michigan at Gingerman Raceway and he told me to buy those exact pads and fluid (ATE Blue). I was just going off his recommendation since I figured he would know. They didn't seem to work any better than my bone stock setup!
Sure create alot of dust, though.
Jeeze, I was hoping to stay away from the Stoptech setup - big $$. But if that is the way to go so there are no worries on cornering, maybe I will have to. Any input on cooling ducts?
Sure create alot of dust, though.
Jeeze, I was hoping to stay away from the Stoptech setup - big $$. But if that is the way to go so there are no worries on cornering, maybe I will have to. Any input on cooling ducts?
Last edited by Tyler Wilson; 10-22-2010 at 05:18 PM.
10-22-2010, 05:18 PM
#7
Someone who runs on a track told you that? Boy, that's scary.
Next time call me.... or someone else with a clue about these cars.
You can stay away from the $2k+ brake kits. Do what I recommended, and swap pads for street use.
Next time call me.... or someone else with a clue about these cars.
You can stay away from the $2k+ brake kits. Do what I recommended, and swap pads for street use.
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10-22-2010, 05:44 PM
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Ok I will just call you and you will tell me what to buy from you. I just want to be able to stop over 500 rwhp on the track without worrying it won't happen.
Thanks Sam
Tyler
Thanks Sam
Tyler
10-22-2010, 09:52 PM
#9
Folks claim changing to SS brake lines gave them a firmer pedal.
Wrong!
The fluid flush required with a brake line change is what changed the pedal feel. Fluid is what compresses (or not) in a hydraulic system, not the lines the fluid passes through.
The lines were expanding you say?
If that's the case, then your fluid was junk as well. No one flushes brake fluid in trashed lines ... well maybe one of you does. But you are an idiot, so you don't count.
Wrong!
The fluid flush required with a brake line change is what changed the pedal feel. Fluid is what compresses (or not) in a hydraulic system, not the lines the fluid passes through.
The lines were expanding you say?
If that's the case, then your fluid was junk as well. No one flushes brake fluid in trashed lines ... well maybe one of you does. But you are an idiot, so you don't count.
10-22-2010, 11:22 PM
#10
I don't know what to say, but you are just misinformed -- and add that to the list of running with no bumpstops and judging how an STB feels while admitting to never running one. 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braided...el_brake_lines
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Braided...el_brake_lines
Folks claim changing to SS brake lines gave them a firmer pedal.
Wrong!
The fluid flush required with a brake line change is what changed the pedal feel. Fluid is what compresses (or not) in a hydraulic system, not the lines the fluid passes through.
The lines were expanding you say?
If that's the case, then your fluid was junk as well.
Wrong!
The fluid flush required with a brake line change is what changed the pedal feel. Fluid is what compresses (or not) in a hydraulic system, not the lines the fluid passes through.
The lines were expanding you say?
If that's the case, then your fluid was junk as well.
10-24-2010, 09:42 AM
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Ok so in my original post I wondered if I could install stainless steel lines and run a better fluid (DOT 5?). Sam suggested a Brembo fluid that had a wet boiling point of 399F - my ATE Blue is 388F boiling point. I think Alec reminded me of that other thread and maybe it was that one that talked about using like a DOT 5 or so fluid. I wasn't sure if going from 388F to 399F was a big deal - maybe it is. So maybe my question is what do I have to do to use a fluid that is WAY better than my ATE Blue since I think it must be getting hot.
Thanks so far guys.
Thanks so far guys.
10-24-2010, 10:12 AM
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This seems very simple to me. Track driving and street driving are not even in the same ballpark. Buy track pads......basically buy what Sam suggested and you wont have problems. If you do any different then you are too cheap or too stupid to know any better.
