Handle like a 911???
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I drove the 2012 911s today. While I can obviously feel that my car is faster. I've never been in a car that made me feel as confident in the curves. Is there anything that can make a TA handle like that. The guy told me $112000. I'm not sure I like it that much. Honestly, if I could put 4 grand into my suspension and make my car handle as well. I'd be satisfied.
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I drove the 2012 911s today. While I can obviously feel that my car is faster. I've never been in a car that made me feel as confident in the curves. Is there anything that can make a TA handle like that. The guy told me $112000. I'm not sure I like it that much. Honestly, if I could put 4 grand into my suspension and make my car handle as well. I'd be satisfied.
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the 911s is a rwd. I think 385hp. The salesman said 400hp. They claim that the only differnce in the s and the turbo is overall speed and acceleration. I've heard that strano has beat some cars with strano springs and konis. I'm just not sure those cars were 911's .
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I can make your car handle like a 911.
But it will cost a lot more than 4K...it's not just shocks and springs.
Here is my car in a nut shell and she handles like a Pcar.
Koni DA's
LG G2 springs
35mm hollow front sway bar
18 or 19mm rear sway bar
18 or 19 Fikse wheels with Michelin Pilot Sport 2 tires 275/295 or 295/315
Brembo 6 piston front brakes on 15" rotors
Watts link
full tubular UMI everything
Recaro seats
lose as much weight off the car as you can possible stand
But it will cost a lot more than 4K...it's not just shocks and springs.
Here is my car in a nut shell and she handles like a Pcar.
Koni DA's
LG G2 springs
35mm hollow front sway bar
18 or 19mm rear sway bar
18 or 19 Fikse wheels with Michelin Pilot Sport 2 tires 275/295 or 295/315
Brembo 6 piston front brakes on 15" rotors
Watts link
full tubular UMI everything
Recaro seats
lose as much weight off the car as you can possible stand
#5
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDxe1lHIxuE
Keep in mind thats pretty much a street Camaro, no chassis mods or weight reduction. Simple bolt in suspension. Some try and say "race car" but that setup is completely street able and arguably more comfortable than stock (thanks to the Konis).
http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...fications.html
With the proper suspension mods these cars are very stable and can handle very well, but you wont get the same feel of a rear engine, short wheel base, IRS porsche, but that doesn't mean you won't out handle one...
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Watch this vid, you see a 911 GT3 toward the middle/end, and you see him pace then pass it...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDxe1lHIxuE
Keep in mind thats pretty much a street Camaro, no chassis mods or weight reduction. Simple bolt in suspension. Some try and say "race car" but that setup is completely street able and arguably more comfortable than stock (thanks to the Konis).
http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...fications.html
With the proper suspension mods these cars are very stable and can handle very well, but you wont get the same feel of a rear engine, short wheel base, IRS porsche, but that doesn't mean you won't out handle one...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDxe1lHIxuE
Keep in mind thats pretty much a street Camaro, no chassis mods or weight reduction. Simple bolt in suspension. Some try and say "race car" but that setup is completely street able and arguably more comfortable than stock (thanks to the Konis).
http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...fications.html
With the proper suspension mods these cars are very stable and can handle very well, but you wont get the same feel of a rear engine, short wheel base, IRS porsche, but that doesn't mean you won't out handle one...
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Building a street car to out-handle a 911 is extremely difficult. However, when it comes to building a track car that can negotiate a track quicker, that's when the advantage can lean toward the F-Body because of the tire it can run. Grip is the F-Bodies friend.
![Grin](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_grin.gif)
If you're interested in getting the car to hook up better on the street or the track, I would be more than happy to help you get the parts you'll need in a package. We can also discuss the brake and tire options that are available to you.
- Kevin
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Getting to match a 911 will be tough, but making the stock 4th gen handle MUCH better is a walk in the park. There's some simple guidelines to go by. I'd search on Sam Strano's posts and see what he's recommended.
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In my opinion, you will never be able to out perform the car. However, you can out perform the driver. I've done it several times on courses and tracks. ![Happy](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_stretch.gif)
I've even put C5 vettes to shame by 2+ seconds on a 60 seconds course....in an s-10 extended cab truck! 90% of it is the driver. I've seen amazing drivers in crappy cars still do amazing things. (Think Ford Tempos and such, no joke).
Trying to get your car to feel (handle, steer, input) like a 911 will be nearly impossible. However getting these cars to feel confident, predictable, and race worth is possible.
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I've even put C5 vettes to shame by 2+ seconds on a 60 seconds course....in an s-10 extended cab truck! 90% of it is the driver. I've seen amazing drivers in crappy cars still do amazing things. (Think Ford Tempos and such, no joke).
Trying to get your car to feel (handle, steer, input) like a 911 will be nearly impossible. However getting these cars to feel confident, predictable, and race worth is possible.
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The weight distribution of a 911 compared to a F-body will always make the two cars *feel* quite different. So you'll potentially get close, but ultimately no cigar.
#12
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And the 911 range includes the 4, 4S, and turbo which are all AWD cars. They have 2wd versions to, I think it's just called the carrera, and carrera S. They also have the GT2 and GT3. I can't remember what the differences are between those. As I said they make like a million different 911's, and if the one you drove was awd then you really won't be able to make it handle the same.
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Clearly I could not run with him on the straights, but I more than did in the corners. And got too close for my comfort under braking (when he then bailed for the pits). FWIW, he was on Michelin Pilot Sport Cups too, not just normal street tires. I was on Hoosier R6's which are nowhere near as sticky as A6's I autocross on, and similar to the Pilot Sport Cups he had.
As for the budget, and how the car can work. It'd be hard for me to spend $4k unless you were hell-bent on a set of KW's over some Koni's and my springs (which what I was running in that video). And yes, I've embarrassed more than a few exotics, even with very good drivers in them. In fact typically the Camaro would run the same times, occassionally better than C5 and C6's like Z06's and Corvettes. What's more is that I have a C6 Z06 in mostly stock trim, and the Camaro was easier to drive fast on the backroads than the Corvette is.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
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Your car will never "feel" like any 911, but you can still definitely build it to tear up on Auto X!
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Agree. That's the bottom line in this issue. A 911 will always be a step ahead.
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Got it. I probably need two different cars iLife the way my ta launches.it feels as if its about to take off with the stock springs. The 911 was definitely slower in the straights but immaking 427/415. I'll try to post a pic I think the car was 2 wd.
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Vastly superior chassis and suspension huh? Struts, and the engine hung out the back? Yeah, not a physics ideal. Porsche has dedicated themselves to making it work. But you'll notice they have other cars that aren't rear-engine too.
An F-body isn't a 911, a Corvette is closer. But you can do pretty amazing things with one, if you know what you are doing (and have enough time and money to spend, just like Porsche did).
An F-body isn't a 911, a Corvette is closer. But you can do pretty amazing things with one, if you know what you are doing (and have enough time and money to spend, just like Porsche did).
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
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Sam - have you ever messed with often overlooked areas of driving characteristics, such as bumpsteer, and tested differences between different settings?
What about corner balancing and weight distrubution? (F-Body specific on this one)
What about corner balancing and weight distrubution? (F-Body specific on this one)
#20
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Yes, of course. I do setup my autocross cars, I own scales, etc.
Bumpsteer is not a big issue on these, unless you slam the car. Even then bumpsteer always exists, you only change the degree of it. Here's one that few consider... you also have to modify the ball joint height too, or you get worse bumpsteer. I don't use bumpsteer kits.
Weight distribution. Not much you can do here unless you start adding a lot of weight to the back, or somehow take a lot from the front.
Corner weighting. If you have coil-overs you can corner weight. But the corner weights on the car aren't horrible even stock.
Bumpsteer is not a big issue on these, unless you slam the car. Even then bumpsteer always exists, you only change the degree of it. Here's one that few consider... you also have to modify the ball joint height too, or you get worse bumpsteer. I don't use bumpsteer kits.
Weight distribution. Not much you can do here unless you start adding a lot of weight to the back, or somehow take a lot from the front.
Corner weighting. If you have coil-overs you can corner weight. But the corner weights on the car aren't horrible even stock.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion