My question is are there a big difference between the 3 point subframe connectors and the regular subframe connectors in handling and stiffness of the car? Basically is the 3 point much better than the other or is there little difference between the two. Thanks!

 

That depends where you're going with the vehicle(s). If you are looking to improve handling, you'll be disappointed with just SFC's, as 4th Gen f-bodies are concerned.

SFC's can stiffen a chassis, however the 4th gens are a lot stiffer than what the consensus mentions around here and with aftermarket manufacturer's claims. I have had several sets installed and removed, and they made no difference as far as handling (If they did, it sure wasn't detected by the seat of the pants), and my vehicle is far from a spring chicken. I still am looking for those infamous quarter panel dimples that are to develop. If it's handling you want to dramatically improve, go right for a set of quality shocks, then springs, then stabiliser bars. Let's not forget a good set of tyres also.

go through these threads and read carefully:

https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspension-brakes/398983-subframe-connectors-2pt-vs-3pt.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspension-brakes/417461-sfc-s-bolt-vs-weld.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspension-brakes/431250-newbie-suspension.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspension-brakes/429520-sfc-worth.html

 

I am going to be using my car for a weekend car / car shows / and occasional track (not a daily driver!). It will have a lot of power when i am done with the heads/cam swap. I'm hoping with a 150 shot i'll hit 600-650rwhp, but we'll see. I am upgrading the entire suspension to include: floor mouted torque arm, coilovers, SA koni's, adj torque arm, STB, LCA's, relocation brackets, and a set of TT2's wrapped in nittos and eventually a 9in rear with 4.10s. So i am going all out with the suspension i just wanted to know if it would be benificial to get 3 point SFC's over the regular ones, im not skimping on the other items and i dont want to skimp on the SFC's but i dont want to spend the extra money if there is no point.

I have read a lot of threads on SFC's and the opinions vary so much its crazy. Some people say its amazing the difference and others say they didnt notice anything. Also thanks for the links i'll read over those.

 

Gotcha, now that I have much better detail of where you're going, and that you plan on basically making it a part-time drag racer (but not necessarily part-time), and you're going to run lot's of HP and floorpan mounted TA, you're going to need 3-point SFC's preferably UMI or SLP, since they have some serious strength to them. Dedicated drag racing alone warrants SFC's.

600-650 rwhp is some serious HP. Since you say that this isn't a daily driver, you could find a roll cage that can somehow tie in with the SFC's, then you've got an even better operation.

 

UMI or SLP over Kenny Brown? I've always read the KB units are the betters. And the UMI three points look like they have a weak point at the forward welding point where the tubing is angle cut and welded down onto the flat welding plate.

 

I was planning on getting the 3 point SFC's from UMI and a roll cage probably from wolfe(I'll need one anyway for when i go to the track) Just about all the rest of my aftermarket suspension is umi. Does anybody know if the umi's do have a weak point over the kenny brown?

 

are you saying all those F-body cars (including mine now removed) with that same dent above center of rear tire is caused by a weak chasis?

now since I've upgraded all my susp. parts can I expect that same dent again?

Thanks for advicing the newbie

 

Hello,

Like Foxxton mentioned we highly recommend the 3-Pont style when running any type of tunnel brace mounted torque arm. This allows the pressure and the force from the torque arm to now be applied and distributed through out the SFC's rather then the floor boards. This also prevents damage that may be caused to the floor mounts when running a tunnel brace mounted torque arm.

There is no weak spot present with this type of SFC and it will handle anything you can throw at them. You will find they are one the tightest fitting 3-point designs available; each bend is formed around the contour of the floor to keep ground clearance issues at a minimum.

If I can help anymore please ask and I will be glad too, thanks

Ryan

 

Okay, cool thanks guys! I'll definitly be going with the 3pt SFC's then.

 

Well, I have had mine for quite a while, and I have yet to see where those "dimples" are coming from. There are none on mine, however I don't perform that heavy, HP drag racing. I will say that if the rear quarter panel "dimples" are developing, you must be doing some heavy burnouts (4000-5000 RPM launches) or some type of extreme activity to cause those dimples, otherwise the 4th gen F-body is far from overall being weak.

I have launched my car when I was a newbie (my 96, and even my 99 that I have now) and had tons wheel hop, however no dimples. Even my friends who constantly drag race their vehicles kept saying that all will develop those rear quarter panel dimples. After many hard street miles, AX, and RR, I have seen none.

My suspension parts have many spherical bearings in them, moderately high spring rates and matching shock valvings, and I have yet to see this thing develop all of the problems that SFC's will cure. I keep thinking to give it time, however I still can't predict when mine (or our other test subject F-bodies) will develop those problems.

By reading your message, I noticed you removed them, however, that's not what I advise if you have them already, however that's what I did to mine just to see if they performing what they've been touted for. None of appear to work for me since I have demands that don't require them, and I also run ~400RWHP/378RWTQ (both SAE corrected), but the thing is that I am not reengineering my vehicle for drag racing, I'm modifying it to become a slighty streetable RR car (note: this car isn't the ultimate beast that a fellow AXer member has, however it is not what I call a daily driver, though I commute long distances with it daily). Basically, I'm not being easy at all with the vehicle, however I'm doing things that are more akin the AXers and RRer's are doing, not what drag racers are doing.

Pretty much it depends on what you're doing with your vehicle. I honestly would like to see a pic of those "dimples" and wrinkles, that people are talking about, because I would like to know where they really came from. If perhaps I develop one in the future, then I can add a pic, however I still am not getting them on my car.

I am not being sarcastic or narcissistic and I don't have any policital motives here, but rather wanting to discover where and what these dimples and wrinkles look like.

Here are a couple of threads to read:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...+panel+dimples
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...+panel+dimples
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...ame+connectors

I understand that the sometimes I can be a cause for a headache, however it's only optional to read posts and/or agree with findings and vice versa.

 

My car has the dreaded dimples. I drag race somewhat frequently, but I am not the first owner. It isn't bad and hardly noticeable, but I see them there. I got the UMI weld-in 2-point SFC's. Extremely nice and quality poduct in every way. I noticed a difference after installing them....mainly just driving down the highway. Car is much tighter and stiffer. Some people don't notice differences, but mine was obvious. Night and day difference.

 

FWIW, SFC's have a noticable difference in SOTP feel in a convertible.

For 600 rwhp, a cage that goes through the floor pan to the subframe is a good idea.