Options to increase cooling capacity?
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
Options to increase cooling capacity? Im wondering what options are out there that help increase the cooling capacity of our cooling system. I was thinking maybe doubling up radiators.... or a larger holding tank... Idk just random thoughts... The problem is I dont want to spend a ton of money on a 4 core radiator and not know if itll be enough. With the A2A intercooler blocking alot of the air im worried on a road course ill start over heating. Ive got a pusher fan on the intercooler, a three core radiator and two 12" fans on the radiator.....
looking for Ideas. and I know on the street ill be fine but the car is built for the road course and will see ALOT of hard WOT use. I want to make sure the Temps dont even think about getting hot...
looking for Ideas. and I know on the street ill be fine but the car is built for the road course and will see ALOT of hard WOT use. I want to make sure the Temps dont even think about getting hot...
Seal off the air box.
Here is an example of an air box we fabricate for our road race cars.
It has a 1/2" x 1/2" aluminum angle frame and roll plastic used on dirt track cars to cover. light, strong and effective.
So you have a pusher in front and 2 pullers in back? Are you sure the 2 pullers aren't trying to pull more air than the pusher can deliver?
I have a Northern all aluminum radiator in my car with a single 16" puller fan on the back side. And not all fans are created equal. I looked at the rock crawlers for help in chosing a fan. They make HUGE power and almost no wheel speed. So the cooling HAS to come from the fan.
Zirgo is by far the brand of choice for that crowd and I haven't had any cooling issues.
Make sure the seal is good and tight on the back side of the hood. Without that seal, air from in front of the windshield will get sucked under the hood, reducing the low pressure zone under the hood. This packs the air under the hood and air movement across the radiator is almost eliminated.
Get a 21-24lb radiator cap. Stock caps are 16-19. Every pound of pressure raises the boiling point of water a couple degrees. So 20lb cap at sea level raises the BP to ~228* F.
Here is a table ...
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/do...perature-2.png
Here is an example of an air box we fabricate for our road race cars.
It has a 1/2" x 1/2" aluminum angle frame and roll plastic used on dirt track cars to cover. light, strong and effective.
So you have a pusher in front and 2 pullers in back? Are you sure the 2 pullers aren't trying to pull more air than the pusher can deliver?
I have a Northern all aluminum radiator in my car with a single 16" puller fan on the back side. And not all fans are created equal. I looked at the rock crawlers for help in chosing a fan. They make HUGE power and almost no wheel speed. So the cooling HAS to come from the fan.
Zirgo is by far the brand of choice for that crowd and I haven't had any cooling issues.
Make sure the seal is good and tight on the back side of the hood. Without that seal, air from in front of the windshield will get sucked under the hood, reducing the low pressure zone under the hood. This packs the air under the hood and air movement across the radiator is almost eliminated.
Get a 21-24lb radiator cap. Stock caps are 16-19. Every pound of pressure raises the boiling point of water a couple degrees. So 20lb cap at sea level raises the BP to ~228* F.
Here is a table ...
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/do...perature-2.png
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
Thats some great info thanks! Ive got a problem enclosing the radiator sicne I have the I/C right infront of the radiator. Im pushing air through the I/C and pulling air through the radiator.
Will it still be effective to include the I/C into the enclosed air passage? rock crawlers make a alot of power but they arent reving as high so there water flow and heat rejection is less. Do you think I would see temps increas on long extend runs of 6500rpms at full boost?
Ill def be increaseing the cap pressure. thanks again!
Will it still be effective to include the I/C into the enclosed air passage? rock crawlers make a alot of power but they arent reving as high so there water flow and heat rejection is less. Do you think I would see temps increas on long extend runs of 6500rpms at full boost?
Ill def be increaseing the cap pressure. thanks again!
6 & 8 Second Club
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,284
Likes: 0
From: Illinois, RT 66 dragway area
.
If there is room, coolant volume will always help.
As mentioned, max efficency of the air available will also help.
Air bouncing all over is not going through the fins. Good luck.
Oh yea, I've been running the 29 lb cap for years.
.
If there is room, coolant volume will always help.
As mentioned, max efficency of the air available will also help.
Air bouncing all over is not going through the fins. Good luck.
Oh yea, I've been running the 29 lb cap for years.
.
Thats some great info thanks! Ive got a problem enclosing the radiator sicne I have the I/C right infront of the radiator. Im pushing air through the I/C and pulling air through the radiator.
Will it still be effective to include the I/C into the enclosed air passage? rock crawlers make a alot of power but they arent reving as high so there water flow and heat rejection is less. Do you think I would see temps increas on long extend runs of 6500rpms at full boost?
Ill def be increaseing the cap pressure. thanks again!
Will it still be effective to include the I/C into the enclosed air passage? rock crawlers make a alot of power but they arent reving as high so there water flow and heat rejection is less. Do you think I would see temps increas on long extend runs of 6500rpms at full boost?
Ill def be increaseing the cap pressure. thanks again!
Impact beam has been removed?
I see no way around NOT including the I/C in the air passage. Like mentioned, you have to get the air flowing down a path with as few changes in direction as possible.
If it's a front breather, you might need to build an air dam or even a splitter to help compact the air through the canal.
I took several radiator caps to a local radiator shop and the owner was gracious enough to test the caps. Most fell below their advertised rating by a couple pounds. So, default high.
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
Coolant volume was one of my ideas but once its heat soaked from an extended green flag pace the radiator may not be able to maintain temps...
Its a front and bottom breather, the bumper support is coming out and replaced by some 1-3/4" tubing, that will give me some more air through there. Ill also take what you said and build sheet metal sides to keep the air going straight through the cores. the only question is how bad will the rejected heat and blockage from the intercooler affect engine temps...
I was thinking about taking two alumium 3 core radiators, cutting the end caps off and merging them into one 6 core.... anyone ever do something like that?
Its a front and bottom breather, the bumper support is coming out and replaced by some 1-3/4" tubing, that will give me some more air through there. Ill also take what you said and build sheet metal sides to keep the air going straight through the cores. the only question is how bad will the rejected heat and blockage from the intercooler affect engine temps...
I was thinking about taking two alumium 3 core radiators, cutting the end caps off and merging them into one 6 core.... anyone ever do something like that?
The intercooler is shedding all its heat onto
the radiator, that's a big lose for engine
heat-throw. Can you, say, duct the IC
outlet air up and the radiator inlet down
and let each one have its own fans &
air source? A canted baffle sheet, like?
I know just the heat from my A/C
condenser overwhelms my skinny 4th-gen
radiator's ability to hold temp, in the
summer.
the radiator, that's a big lose for engine
heat-throw. Can you, say, duct the IC
outlet air up and the radiator inlet down
and let each one have its own fans &
air source? A canted baffle sheet, like?
I know just the heat from my A/C
condenser overwhelms my skinny 4th-gen
radiator's ability to hold temp, in the
summer.
Trending Topics
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
Ya I was thinking about that but there really isnt a way to split the in.. there jsut isnt any room... im Ok with adding the heate from the IC to the radiator sicne the air stream will be the most efficent that way, I jsut want to make sure the radiator is sized right to keep temps in range... now instead of the radiator seeing 80* air its seeing ~120* it needs to be larger to slow the water down and give it more time to disapate the heat...
That seems to be what I keep coming back to.. I can divert and force the air to go where I want but in the end i still need to have more cooling capacity in the in radiator due to a higher air temp... Atleast thats how it looks to me..
That seems to be what I keep coming back to.. I can divert and force the air to go where I want but in the end i still need to have more cooling capacity in the in radiator due to a higher air temp... Atleast thats how it looks to me..
LS1 Tech Stories
The Best V8 Stories One Small Block at Time
6 Common C5 Corvette Failures and What's Involved In Repairing Them
Pouria Savadkouei
Retro Modern Bandit Pontiac Trans AM Comes With Burt Reynolds' Autograph
Verdad Gallardo
Top 10 Greatest Cadillac V Series Performance Models Ever, Ranked
Pouria Savadkouei
Top 10 Most Powerful Chevy Trucks Ever Made!
Hennessey's New Supercharged Silverado ZR2 Has 700 HP
Verdad Gallardo
Coachbuilt N2A Anteros Is an LS2-Powered C6 Corvette In Italian Clothes
Verdad Gallardo
Awesome K5 Blazer Restomod Comes With C7 Corvette Power
Verdad Gallardo
10 Camaros You Should Never Buy
10 LS Engine Myths That Refuse to Die
Verdad Gallardo 6 & 8 Second Club
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,284
Likes: 0
From: Illinois, RT 66 dragway area
If you have room for 2 radiators, have you thought of using some big alum tubing, 3" & building your own cross flow type deal.
Might be easier & more efficient than merging tanks?? Or if you are really looking to get max cooling, how about quad flow??
Make both radiators crossflow, & connect in series?? Good luck.
.
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
Hmmm I like the series idea that actaully might work. I have a decent amount of room between the radiator and the engine I may be able to push the second radiator back into the engine bay more and then just connect them in series... think I would have any problems bleading air out? all I would have to do would be relocate one of the hose connections.... thanks! the wheels are turning 
I know im going overkill for 99.9% of the time but for those days when I pay 250+ for track/garage fees I dont want to end up sitting in the garage with an overheated car.. so spending the extra money now helps eliminate that possibility.. thanks for the input!
I know im going overkill for 99.9% of the time but for those days when I pay 250+ for track/garage fees I dont want to end up sitting in the garage with an overheated car.. so spending the extra money now helps eliminate that possibility.. thanks for the input!
6 & 8 Second Club
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,284
Likes: 0
From: Illinois, RT 66 dragway area
.
Yes, my idea needs one of the hoses to be moved, but I was thinking it's easier to do my idea.
Then build custom tanks, get them to seal perfect & still have hot spots.
My idea makes every ounce get cooled twice. If you are worried about air pockets, you can do what I did.
I run 2 caps. 1 on engine, 1 on radiator. Some guys run 1 on engine & weld up radiator.
.
Yes, my idea needs one of the hoses to be moved, but I was thinking it's easier to do my idea.
Then build custom tanks, get them to seal perfect & still have hot spots.
My idea makes every ounce get cooled twice. If you are worried about air pockets, you can do what I did.
I run 2 caps. 1 on engine, 1 on radiator. Some guys run 1 on engine & weld up radiator.
.
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
ya your idea is much easier in the long run and depending on the radiators I chose I may not have to relocate the connections.. also If I use two radiators, each one will have a cap and be able to relieve air individually.... Im now trying to figure out which routing option is best...
Option 1: Starting at the engine the leaving water would go in the top of rad 1, leave at the bottom of rad one and go into the top of rad two and leave the bottom of rad 2 entering the suction side of the water pump..
Option 2: start at the engine like Option one and enter Rad one at the top, leave at teh bottom but enter Rad 2 at the bottom rather than the top and leave to the water pump at the bottom of rad 2... This would have a possiblility of short cycling the water through Rad 2 but emilinates any air problems...
ultimatly if Im going to go this route Ill probably go with Option 1 since its gets the most passes with no short cycling..
Option 1: Starting at the engine the leaving water would go in the top of rad 1, leave at the bottom of rad one and go into the top of rad two and leave the bottom of rad 2 entering the suction side of the water pump..
Option 2: start at the engine like Option one and enter Rad one at the top, leave at teh bottom but enter Rad 2 at the bottom rather than the top and leave to the water pump at the bottom of rad 2... This would have a possiblility of short cycling the water through Rad 2 but emilinates any air problems...
ultimatly if Im going to go this route Ill probably go with Option 1 since its gets the most passes with no short cycling..
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
You know I was thinking something similar this weekend and was on the phone with Muscle motorsports (they sell used nascar parts) and they have Griffin 5" thick radiators. the Used nascar radiator is cheaper than a factory style radiator that I would have to buy to double them up... looks like Ill just have to do some more fabrication to get the 5" thick 30X19 radiator to fit I cant even imagine what a 5" thick radiator will look like in there! can you say OVERKILL!
I cant even imagine what a 5" thick radiator will look like in there! can you say OVERKILL! LOL, I was thinking of a Ron Davis instead. Direct drop in replacement but they also have their race series as well. Worth a look anyway and I can get you a deal on them.
http://www.ccperformanceparts.com/id73.html
http://www.ccperformanceparts.com/id73.html
TECH Fanatic
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,516
Likes: 0
I have an 85 s10 with a 383 in it that constantly overheated with many different radiator setups. I installed one of those griffin 2x1 1/4 in tube radiators, and now it goes up to the thermostat opening temp and then shoots back down to around 150 degrees. I think one 5" griffin radiator will do the trick. That will greatly increase your cooling capacity and you wont have all that funny plumbing to deal with. I also run two radiator caps, because the top of the radiator is below the thermostat housing. It works great to get all the air out.
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (4)
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 612
Likes: 0
From: Nashville, TN
Yup, the Nascar style radiator im getting doesnt have a fill port on the radiator so a remote cap and expansion tank is needed. I had planned on somehting similar anyway so thats no big deal.
