Cop shoots motorcyclist in the back...
05-22-2010, 12:04 AM
#101
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As has been stated on here multiple times I agree with everything the officer did, up until he pulled the trigger. Hindsight is 20/20, but I agree that the officer should not have discharged his weapon. What I don't agree with is all of this bashing on LEO's. Now I understand that some of you have had past events that will make you heavily biased when it comes to this kind of thing, but you must all remember that for every bad story that is reported, there are thousands of good stories that go unreported. To say that all or most LEO's are bad individuals that abuse their power is very wrong. I read a story in the paper this morning, long story short, an officer was shot during a routine traffic stop by the passenger of the car he had stopped. The guy just jumped out and opened fire. The officer was hit in the abdomen and will survive. This is the kind of garbage that LEO's have to deal with, so your damn right they should always be ready for anything, whether it be by having their hand on their weapon or having it drawn. For anyone to say its over the top to draw your weapon during a traffic stop is absurd. If an LEO feels the need to draw his weapon he should do so with no hesitation, however actually pulling the trigger is a whole different discussion. We can all sit here and argue back and forth, but at the end of the day no one is going to be happy or satisfied. I do feel however that if people are going to keep making threads on the "bad" examples of LEO's they should expect to see new threads of LEO's being hero's and making the right split second decision. But that would just clutter up the section so I won't do that.
well said
05-22-2010, 06:39 PM
#102
seems to me like he was trying to protect and serve himself, not the public as is his job, which makes me think the bigger problem was his attitude about being a cop. the guy was sitting down with his back to the officer who is apparently in shooting stance with gun drawn, probably behind his door, how is this threatening? even if he had a gun he'd have to get off the bike and turn around to use it properly. i can respect the dangers police face on the job, but this just wasn't it. the police are there to protect us, we shouldn't fear for our lives wheneve
i got nothing against police. in fact i even know an officer that had to discharge his weapon in the line of duty. He's an excellent officer and tried every means possible to avoid shooting the guy but the guy persisted and so he was shot as a LAST resort, not as a best option. someone pulled over by the police doesn't automatically become the enemy, they are still the public which they are to protect and serve.
also, to whoever said they should've shot him in the leg. any situation that warrants discharging of the firearm, warrants a shot to kill. if it doesn't warrant a shot to kill, then you shouldn't be shooting in the first place. a discharging a firearm for police is supposed to be a last resort LETHAL option and nothing else.
i got nothing against police. in fact i even know an officer that had to discharge his weapon in the line of duty. He's an excellent officer and tried every means possible to avoid shooting the guy but the guy persisted and so he was shot as a LAST resort, not as a best option. someone pulled over by the police doesn't automatically become the enemy, they are still the public which they are to protect and serve.
also, to whoever said they should've shot him in the leg. any situation that warrants discharging of the firearm, warrants a shot to kill. if it doesn't warrant a shot to kill, then you shouldn't be shooting in the first place. a discharging a firearm for police is supposed to be a last resort LETHAL option and nothing else.
05-22-2010, 07:40 PM
#104
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Lets say the guy did have a gun but the cop wasn't trigger happy...the guy could have turned left and fired...remember someone starts to shoot at you you are going for cover...from their the possibilities are endless...
05-22-2010, 09:22 PM
#106
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You have no idea how quickly someone can shot a gun, about 10 years ago an LAPD officer was chasing a man with a gun, the guy, while running, fired over his shoulder and struck the officer in the forehead killing him instantly, completely lucky shot on the part of the suspect. There is a few guys who are championship marksman who can draw and fire in under a second, thats faster then your mind can tell your finger to pull the trigger when you have your gun out and pointing at someone. The fact is you dont know, the officer from his angle very well could have thought he was reaching for a gun in his waistband because you forget, the motorcycle might have been directly in front of the black and white dash cam but the officer is several feet to the suspects left where he cant see his right hand at all.
you said it well. you don't know. the officer didn't know. he assumed, but to assume he was armed, AND that he had the worst intentions is worse than letting your guard down.
05-23-2010, 12:11 AM
#107
did you just extrapolate world championship status sharp shooters into a into a traffic stop where the man was drunk and high?
you said it well. you don't know. the officer didn't know. he assumed, but to assume he was armed, AND that he had the worst intentions is worse than letting your guard down.
you said it well. you don't know. the officer didn't know. he assumed, but to assume he was armed, AND that he had the worst intentions is worse than letting your guard down.
My point i am trying to make is that if someone has a gun and doesnt want to go to jail they dont care what position they are in, look at this video, the guy goes back to his car to get his gun and now the officer is dead, how long did it take the guy to get the gun out from behind his seat and kills the officer, a good 30 seconds at least. Now say this guy is wanted or knows he will go to jail and he has a gun, so he calmly without alerting the officer acts like he is just sitting on his bike but pulls out a gun with his right hand that the officer cant see, then when the officer walks up he shoots him. Fact is the officer saw a furtive movement, which is a superior court term that has been established in several court cases, and believed the guy went for a gun so he shot. Yes he was wrong, its similar to the kid who walked up to the cop pretending he had a gun but had a cell phone instead. Officers have a split second to make a decision and for them it is life or death. Take that into consideration before you condemn this and every other officer out there.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX5kwVc9IOk
Last edited by transambandit; 05-23-2010 at 12:17 AM. Reason: add video
05-23-2010, 01:02 AM
#108
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2nd that video is completely different from the first video. the officer was communicating with the man who was acting extremely suspicious in the first place, instead of sitting calmly with his back to the officer. the officer knew he had a gun and told him several times to drop it.
3rd i don't know if you've ever ridden a bike, but you can't carry anything unless it's in a backpack. if he was carrying a gun it would have had to been in a holster, in which case it would have been visible from the car.
4th it's not like the kid because he was behaving as if he did have a gun while the man on the motorcycle was not. nor did he make a furtive movement. there's nothing stealthy about turning your head
05-23-2010, 02:02 AM
#109
1st off i'm not condemning every officer. read the rest of my post in this thread before you accuse me of such. i was remarking on the attitude of the officer in the first video alone.
2nd that video is completely different from the first video. the officer was communicating with the man who was acting extremely suspicious in the first place, instead of sitting calmly with his back to the officer. the officer knew he had a gun and told him several times to drop it.
3rd i don't know if you've ever ridden a bike, but you can't carry anything unless it's in a backpack. if he was carrying a gun it would have had to been in a holster, in which case it would have been visible from the car.
4th it's not like the kid because he was behaving as if he did have a gun while the man on the motorcycle was not. nor did he make a furtive movement. there's nothing stealthy about turning your head
2nd that video is completely different from the first video. the officer was communicating with the man who was acting extremely suspicious in the first place, instead of sitting calmly with his back to the officer. the officer knew he had a gun and told him several times to drop it.
3rd i don't know if you've ever ridden a bike, but you can't carry anything unless it's in a backpack. if he was carrying a gun it would have had to been in a holster, in which case it would have been visible from the car.
4th it's not like the kid because he was behaving as if he did have a gun while the man on the motorcycle was not. nor did he make a furtive movement. there's nothing stealthy about turning your head
05-23-2010, 03:22 AM
#110
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I'm coming into this WAY late, I know... But I have some thoughts on what I've read. To save some reading for anyone... The cop was WRONG and COMMITTED A CRIME! He was rightfully convicted and impo should have been eligible for much more time in prison than he'll get.
How about... The same way everyone else is judged? Does that not sound reasonable to you? He's going to prison, where any criminal belongs.
The thing is, it STILL could've been avoided altogether! The cop CHOSE to do the wrong thing. Was he nervous? Probably, but that will never justify shooting an unarmed man, even if the cop THOUGHT the man was armed... By the way... In his own defense, the COP told the jury that they should NOT trust the dash cam video because IT couldn't show all that he could see... So that theory you offered, according to the cop, is out the window... it also sealed the asshats fate with his jury, thank God.
They don't call it a "cop out" for nothin'...
NONE of what those riders did warranted being shot AT, let alone hit. The cop lacked proper training and discipline, end of story.
Let's NOT say the biker had a gun... After all, he didn't. Even if he had, the odds of him using it effectively were slim and none, considering his position in relation to the police car and the cop himself. Even a sharpshooter would likely have been unable to offer serious offense to the cop. The cop would've easily been able to retreat behind his own vehicle if necessary, but it wasn't.
"All the laws" the bikers broke? You mean speeding, and POSSIBLY being drunk? Those are the only possibilities we can see in the video. Now let's ask what the biker was actually charged with and found guilty of committing??
Two "uneasy riders" don't put "everybody's life in danger" at any point. There was hardly anyone on the road, first of all. Secondly, most who were were in cars or at very least, not on foot. The patrol cars were 10 times as dangerous, or more. The "running" part really didn't happen. They stopped within about 5 seconds of the chase beginning... It IS on video, ya know...
The biker didn't hear the cops command, which, INCIDENTALLY, was NOT to put his hands up. Testimony revealed 2 things of importance. #1, the cop failed to follow protocol by NOT turning off his siren.. this prevented the biker from hearing any command. #2, the cop said, "GET OFF THE BIKE." instead of "put your hands up." Then the cop failed to give the rider even 3 seconds to comply before putting a bullet in the mans back, leading to a lifetime in a wheelchair for the would be suspect who became a victim of police violence.
For good measure, the cops refused to help the man after he was shot. His bike's exhaust burned him badly and he could still feel the pain. These are BAD COPS, nothing else. They acted in bad faith and not only tossed out the rule book, but then 1 tried to cover up the crime he committed.
It is very easy to be a monday morning quarterback when you are sitting at home behind a computer screen. Did you ever think that the Police Officer could of been in fear of being shot because of the movement he made with his right hand. I don't understand how people judge a Police Officer who obviously made a mistake with a jail sentence.
I bet you wouldn't be saying that if the guy on the motorcycle ran over your child half way down the road...bet you would be happy the guy got shot then...makes no sense why the guy looked over his right shoulder when the cop was on the left side of him...did you ever think about what kind of line of sight the officer had??? It was way less than what the dash cam showed...did someone mention that the motorcyclist were both drunk and high??? Do you like drunks driving around on the same roads you do???
The officer should get some jail time and a fine but if the guy hadn't broken multiple laws in the first place this could have been avoided all together...
The officer should get some jail time and a fine but if the guy hadn't broken multiple laws in the first place this could have been avoided all together...
I really don't think the officer drew his gun out just because they were messing with him. All the laws, that the individual broke is EXACTLY why the officer had his gun out. I'm not condoning/not-condoning the end results of the stop, but the officer was in my opinion justified for drawing his weapon on the rider. He was never in full compliance, hands were never in the air, never put the kick stand down, so what I am GUESSING is the officer thought he was non- compliant on purpose. He had no before hand knowledge, the driver was high or drunk. All the officer knew from the video that was shown, was he hit the lights and sirens, the bikers took off. I'm pretty sure he is thinking, why are they running? What did they just do?
Of course you might be a little angry that these 2 people, put everybody's life in danger by running from the police.
Let's say the rider had a gun, and the officer did not draw on him. We would be hearing about a dead officer in the news, because he did not draw his weapon, or got complacent in dealing with the public. The only debate is if it was a justified shooting or not. Up until that point, I have no problems with what the officer did or handled. If I was that officer, I would do the same thing, but the shooting I don't know.
Of course you might be a little angry that these 2 people, put everybody's life in danger by running from the police.
Let's say the rider had a gun, and the officer did not draw on him. We would be hearing about a dead officer in the news, because he did not draw his weapon, or got complacent in dealing with the public. The only debate is if it was a justified shooting or not. Up until that point, I have no problems with what the officer did or handled. If I was that officer, I would do the same thing, but the shooting I don't know.
NONE of what those riders did warranted being shot AT, let alone hit. The cop lacked proper training and discipline, end of story.
Let's NOT say the biker had a gun... After all, he didn't. Even if he had, the odds of him using it effectively were slim and none, considering his position in relation to the police car and the cop himself. Even a sharpshooter would likely have been unable to offer serious offense to the cop. The cop would've easily been able to retreat behind his own vehicle if necessary, but it wasn't.
"All the laws" the bikers broke? You mean speeding, and POSSIBLY being drunk? Those are the only possibilities we can see in the video. Now let's ask what the biker was actually charged with and found guilty of committing??
Two "uneasy riders" don't put "everybody's life in danger" at any point. There was hardly anyone on the road, first of all. Secondly, most who were were in cars or at very least, not on foot. The patrol cars were 10 times as dangerous, or more. The "running" part really didn't happen. They stopped within about 5 seconds of the chase beginning... It IS on video, ya know...
The biker didn't hear the cops command, which, INCIDENTALLY, was NOT to put his hands up. Testimony revealed 2 things of importance. #1, the cop failed to follow protocol by NOT turning off his siren.. this prevented the biker from hearing any command. #2, the cop said, "GET OFF THE BIKE." instead of "put your hands up." Then the cop failed to give the rider even 3 seconds to comply before putting a bullet in the mans back, leading to a lifetime in a wheelchair for the would be suspect who became a victim of police violence.
For good measure, the cops refused to help the man after he was shot. His bike's exhaust burned him badly and he could still feel the pain. These are BAD COPS, nothing else. They acted in bad faith and not only tossed out the rule book, but then 1 tried to cover up the crime he committed.
05-23-2010, 03:24 AM
#111
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As you seen you were corrected about the laws the biker broke but reread my post and you will see that if I were on the jury he would get a couple of years and a fine...
Try to sit back and look at the other side of things...not saying that way you can justify what happened but rather to know why you feel the way you do...everyone is quick to point a finger and have tunnel vision about the event but they don't think of what else could of happened such as a child running out in front of the biker when he was accelerating hard...did it happen no but could it happen yes and that was what the officer was trying prevent from happening...the biker was endangering the safty of the public
Try to sit back and look at the other side of things...not saying that way you can justify what happened but rather to know why you feel the way you do...everyone is quick to point a finger and have tunnel vision about the event but they don't think of what else could of happened such as a child running out in front of the biker when he was accelerating hard...did it happen no but could it happen yes and that was what the officer was trying prevent from happening...the biker was endangering the safty of the public
Had this been the other way around, where the biker shot an unarmed cop, you'd be shouting for the death penalty, I'm sure. Indeed, had the biker shot THAT cop, who was armed, you'd still want max penalties... now wouldn't ya!
It's not speculation. It does happen, and officers get killed for it. I have no problems whatsoever with this officer and what he did. The only thing that is debatable is the shooting.
The link you posted was a accidental shooting. The officer was serving a High Risk search warrant, on a Murder suspect. The suspects grandmother started to tussle with the officer, and prevent him from searching the home. In the struggle the gun went off. Although it is tragic and sad, I cannot see in any way how that is the officers fault.
The link you posted was a accidental shooting. The officer was serving a High Risk search warrant, on a Murder suspect. The suspects grandmother started to tussle with the officer, and prevent him from searching the home. In the struggle the gun went off. Although it is tragic and sad, I cannot see in any way how that is the officers fault.
And if you didn't already know it, the "suspect" wasn't in that home. He was in the one above it. Further, the woman in the "tussle" was not his grandmother... Look at some facts. He is 34... She is 46. Odds aren't too high that she had children who had children... WHEN SHE WAS ONLY 12! Finally, it is ALWAYS the officers fault when his service weapon discharges a round. It's his/her professional responsibility to maintain control of his/her weapon, especially in this type of situation, where training and REaction is key to every outcome. If'n yer gonna bust the door down... BE prepared for a fight! I hate to put it this way, but *I* would've knocked out grannies teeth and maintained control of my weapon, even in that situation. I just would've...
The fact is you dont know, the officer from his angle very well could have thought he was reaching for a gun in his waistband because you forget, the motorcycle might have been directly in front of the black and white dash cam but the officer is several feet to the suspects left where he cant see his right hand at all.
My point i am trying to make is that if someone has a gun and doesnt want to go to jail they dont care what position they are in, look at this video, the guy goes back to his car to get his gun and now the officer is dead, how long did it take the guy to get the gun out from behind his seat and kills the officer, a good 30 seconds at least. Now say this guy is wanted or knows he will go to jail and he has a gun, so he calmly without alerting the officer acts like he is just sitting on his bike but pulls out a gun with his right hand that the officer cant see, then when the officer walks up he shoots him. Fact is the officer saw a furtive movement, which is a superior court term that has been established in several court cases, and believed the guy went for a gun so he shot. Yes he was wrong, its similar to the kid who walked up to the cop pretending he had a gun but had a cell phone instead. Officers have a split second to make a decision and for them it is life or death. Take that into consideration before you condemn this and every other officer out there.
The 2nd video shows a cop who had a reason to shoot and not only hesitated, but missed his target when he finally decided to tack action. The 1st acted far too quickly while the 2nd acted far too slowly. BOTH cops took the wrong action. One nearly killed an innocent man while the other apparently died after taking no action when he should've acted swiftly. I feel bad for the cop who was obviously shot... but MAN... He screwed himself! Like in the 1st video, he stopped his patrol car in an improper position, LIMITING it's ability to offer a barrier between himself and the bad guy.
05-23-2010, 01:32 PM
#112
If the officer was trying to prevent such a thing from happening, as you foolishly claim, why would he attempt a high speed chase in the middle of the night, when nearly nobody was on the road anyway?
Had this been the other way around, where the biker shot an unarmed cop, you'd be shouting for the death penalty, I'm sure. Indeed, had the biker shot THAT cop, who was armed, you'd still want max penalties... now wouldn't ya!
If your response was strictly about the cop killing the 7yr old, I agree it was accidental too, but it was just as wrong. I have no way to fully agree, however... Because the cop clearly lost control of his weapon... It wasn't bad enough that he lost control... He had to go and lose control to a grandma...
And if you didn't already know it, the "suspect" wasn't in that home. He was in the one above it. Further, the woman in the "tussle" was not his grandmother... Look at some facts. He is 34... She is 46. Odds aren't too high that she had children who had children... WHEN SHE WAS ONLY 12! Finally, it is ALWAYS the officers fault when his service weapon discharges a round. It's his/her professional responsibility to maintain control of his/her weapon, especially in this type of situation, where training and REaction is key to every outcome. If'n yer gonna bust the door down... BE prepared for a fight! I hate to put it this way, but *I* would've knocked out grannies teeth and maintained control of my weapon, even in that situation. I just would've...
This seems to be a theme on your part... The biker was NOT eluding. Further, he wasn't charged with eluding. It appears EVEN the dumb *** who SHOT HIM agrees he wasn't eluding! This is one possible reason he rewound his evidence tape...
Uh... I'm not sure which cop school you've been attending, but that's TOTALLY wrong. It's the cops job to put him/herself INTO harms way, if necessary, SPECIFICALLY TO PROTECT OTHERS! On the other hand, I personally don't think it should remotely be a cops job to protect me, just to uphold the law. In the case in question, the cop didn't protect anyone... He just attempted to murder someone and it was caught on his own dash cam tape. Sure, he claimed this and that... He SHOT an unarmed man without any provocation... Were it someone NOT a cop, this would be called "attempted 1st degree murder," but it WAS a cop...
According to the video and the testimony, there was no "chase" involved. The cop took off after the bikers, turned on his lights, then siren... The bikers stopped within SECONDS. They didn't go trying to escape or elude and the cops involved SAID SO!
Not fer nuthin'.... How can someone DO what can't be done? I mean, if there are people who can do it, then maybe it ISN'T faster than the brain can send the signal... I'm just sayin'...
This leads to the whole, "Why'd the cop put himself in such a compromising position, anyway?" thought... He parked his car incorrectly, leaving himself less room for cover. He made it really easy for the dash cam to catch his errors though... The COP, in this case, broke more laws than the bikers did... THAT, not just according to me, but according to a veteran cop with some 48yrs experience!!
There's NO comparison between your video and the 1st, except that each involved a cop. The 1st video shows a cop breaking the law.
The 2nd video shows a cop who had a reason to shoot and not only hesitated, but missed his target when he finally decided to tack action. The 1st acted far too quickly while the 2nd acted far too slowly. BOTH cops took the wrong action. One nearly killed an innocent man while the other apparently died after taking no action when he should've acted swiftly. I feel bad for the cop who was obviously shot... but MAN... He screwed himself! Like in the 1st video, he stopped his patrol car in an improper position, LIMITING it's ability to offer a barrier between himself and the bad guy.
Had this been the other way around, where the biker shot an unarmed cop, you'd be shouting for the death penalty, I'm sure. Indeed, had the biker shot THAT cop, who was armed, you'd still want max penalties... now wouldn't ya!
If your response was strictly about the cop killing the 7yr old, I agree it was accidental too, but it was just as wrong. I have no way to fully agree, however... Because the cop clearly lost control of his weapon... It wasn't bad enough that he lost control... He had to go and lose control to a grandma...
And if you didn't already know it, the "suspect" wasn't in that home. He was in the one above it. Further, the woman in the "tussle" was not his grandmother... Look at some facts. He is 34... She is 46. Odds aren't too high that she had children who had children... WHEN SHE WAS ONLY 12! Finally, it is ALWAYS the officers fault when his service weapon discharges a round. It's his/her professional responsibility to maintain control of his/her weapon, especially in this type of situation, where training and REaction is key to every outcome. If'n yer gonna bust the door down... BE prepared for a fight! I hate to put it this way, but *I* would've knocked out grannies teeth and maintained control of my weapon, even in that situation. I just would've...
This seems to be a theme on your part... The biker was NOT eluding. Further, he wasn't charged with eluding. It appears EVEN the dumb *** who SHOT HIM agrees he wasn't eluding! This is one possible reason he rewound his evidence tape...
Uh... I'm not sure which cop school you've been attending, but that's TOTALLY wrong. It's the cops job to put him/herself INTO harms way, if necessary, SPECIFICALLY TO PROTECT OTHERS! On the other hand, I personally don't think it should remotely be a cops job to protect me, just to uphold the law. In the case in question, the cop didn't protect anyone... He just attempted to murder someone and it was caught on his own dash cam tape. Sure, he claimed this and that... He SHOT an unarmed man without any provocation... Were it someone NOT a cop, this would be called "attempted 1st degree murder," but it WAS a cop...
According to the video and the testimony, there was no "chase" involved. The cop took off after the bikers, turned on his lights, then siren... The bikers stopped within SECONDS. They didn't go trying to escape or elude and the cops involved SAID SO!
Not fer nuthin'.... How can someone DO what can't be done? I mean, if there are people who can do it, then maybe it ISN'T faster than the brain can send the signal... I'm just sayin'...
This leads to the whole, "Why'd the cop put himself in such a compromising position, anyway?" thought... He parked his car incorrectly, leaving himself less room for cover. He made it really easy for the dash cam to catch his errors though... The COP, in this case, broke more laws than the bikers did... THAT, not just according to me, but according to a veteran cop with some 48yrs experience!!
There's NO comparison between your video and the 1st, except that each involved a cop. The 1st video shows a cop breaking the law.
The 2nd video shows a cop who had a reason to shoot and not only hesitated, but missed his target when he finally decided to tack action. The 1st acted far too quickly while the 2nd acted far too slowly. BOTH cops took the wrong action. One nearly killed an innocent man while the other apparently died after taking no action when he should've acted swiftly. I feel bad for the cop who was obviously shot... but MAN... He screwed himself! Like in the 1st video, he stopped his patrol car in an improper position, LIMITING it's ability to offer a barrier between himself and the bad guy.
05-23-2010, 04:28 PM
#113
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In the video you can cleary see his right hand go to his right hip, now imagine what that would look like when you are standing 10 feet to the side and 10 feet behind someone, you can see his shoulder turn, elbow come up etc. It can easily be interpreted as a furtive movement.
i'm done with this argument. i will say this though, i don't hate police as you seem to believe. far from it, i hate it when guy like this ignores what he was taught because he thinks he knows best. Officers like that are the reason that there are people that hate the police.
05-23-2010, 05:33 PM
#114
bwahaha. hardly a furtive movement. a furtive movement is sly and stealthy, that movement was deliberate and as i said earlier if he was wearing a gun it would have been clearly visible as he was riding a motorcycle.
i'm done with this argument. i will say this though, i don't hate police as you seem to believe. far from it, i hate it when guy like this ignores what he was taught because he thinks he knows best. Officers like that are the reason that there are people that hate the police.
i'm done with this argument. i will say this though, i don't hate police as you seem to believe. far from it, i hate it when guy like this ignores what he was taught because he thinks he knows best. Officers like that are the reason that there are people that hate the police.
05-23-2010, 06:03 PM
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You are actually completely missing my point of posting the video, its not that the circumstances behind the video are similar its to show that if someone wants too, they will shoot it out with the cops, it doesnt matter if they are sitting on a bike with their back to the officer.
Doesnt matter that it is a 10 to 1 odds that they will win because they would rather die then go back to jail. there are people out there who, if caught will spend 20+ years in jail for a 3rd strike and would rather die then go back to jail. So just because the angle is impossible, doesnt mean the guy sitting on the bike wouldnt risk it to avoid jail. You simply dont know what this guy might be running from, there might be a warrant for him, he might have absconded from his parole, whatever. Cops dont know who they are contacting when they make a traffic stop and they get a split second to decide whether they live or die that night. That is all the point i am trying to make.
If that cop was convinced he had reason for major concern, explain why he parked as he did? Explain why he left his siren on, making it almost impossible for anyone to hear his commands. Explain why he fired a round before the rider ever spoke to him. Explain why he shot an unarmed man. Most of all at this point, explain why he tried to erase his video tape evidence... HE knew he was wrong, end of story.
Cops do have to make split second decisions. Nobody's arguing that point. However, they're EXPECTED to make the correct decision EVERY SINGLE TIME! We all have those moments in life, so I expect nothing less from a cop than I do from myself. I KNOW there's no chance I'd have shot that guy in that situation, because my mindset is different. He let his anger control his actions rather than his mind control his anger.
I don't even care what defenders say at this point... The jury said their part because they saw the truth of the matter.
And by the way... In response to your comment to hotpocket, we DO know what was going through his mind. He explained it on the witness stand, shortly before being convicted of 2 felony crimes. Just so ya know...
05-23-2010, 07:15 PM
#116
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All you've done is provide reason to see things differently than you're seeing them. Clearly, comparing the 2 videos, it DOES matter. The guy who shot the cop in your video got a rifle out. The guy on the bike could have done no such thing without the cop seeing it right away, before even getting out of his patrol car. Most importantly, the guy on the bike WAS unarmed. If he had wanted to hurt the cop, he could've simply NOT stopped until he had an advantage, which is not the reality if what he did. It isn't a question of what the rider might have done. It's a question of what he DID. Unlike the guy in the pickup, the biker had no cover, no concealment, no weapon... and NO chance!
The fact is, he WASN'T running from anything! He was sitting on a stopped motorcycle. That's where he was AND what he was doing when he was shot in the back for no reason, PERIOD... NO REASON!
If that cop was convinced he had reason for major concern, explain why he parked as he did? Explain why he left his siren on, making it almost impossible for anyone to hear his commands. Explain why he fired a round before the rider ever spoke to him. Explain why he shot an unarmed man. Most of all at this point, explain why he tried to erase his video tape evidence... HE knew he was wrong, end of story.
Cops do have to make split second decisions. Nobody's arguing that point. However, they're EXPECTED to make the correct decision EVERY SINGLE TIME! We all have those moments in life, so I expect nothing less from a cop than I do from myself. I KNOW there's no chance I'd have shot that guy in that situation, because my mindset is different. He let his anger control his actions rather than his mind control his anger.
I don't even care what defenders say at this point... The jury said their part because they saw the truth of the matter.
And by the way... In response to your comment to hotpocket, we DO know what was going through his mind. He explained it on the witness stand, shortly before being convicted of 2 felony crimes. Just so ya know...
The fact is, he WASN'T running from anything! He was sitting on a stopped motorcycle. That's where he was AND what he was doing when he was shot in the back for no reason, PERIOD... NO REASON!
If that cop was convinced he had reason for major concern, explain why he parked as he did? Explain why he left his siren on, making it almost impossible for anyone to hear his commands. Explain why he fired a round before the rider ever spoke to him. Explain why he shot an unarmed man. Most of all at this point, explain why he tried to erase his video tape evidence... HE knew he was wrong, end of story.
Cops do have to make split second decisions. Nobody's arguing that point. However, they're EXPECTED to make the correct decision EVERY SINGLE TIME! We all have those moments in life, so I expect nothing less from a cop than I do from myself. I KNOW there's no chance I'd have shot that guy in that situation, because my mindset is different. He let his anger control his actions rather than his mind control his anger.
I don't even care what defenders say at this point... The jury said their part because they saw the truth of the matter.
And by the way... In response to your comment to hotpocket, we DO know what was going through his mind. He explained it on the witness stand, shortly before being convicted of 2 felony crimes. Just so ya know...
If that cop was convinced he had reason for major concern, explain why he parked as he did? Explain why he left his siren on, making it almost impossible for anyone to hear his commands. Explain why he fired a round before the rider ever spoke to him. Explain why he shot an unarmed man. Most of all at this point, explain why he tried to erase his video tape evidence... HE knew he was wrong, end of story.
Police departments run off statistics...he parked his car and had his sirens on because statistically when a biker stops in a pursuit situation he jumps off and runs...so cop was jumping out ready to run after him...the rider appeared to be reaching for a gun...if you read earlier postings you would have read that he testified that he rewinded it to see what just happened...it was not proven that he was rewinding the tape to erase it...now if you try to tell me to think about it and say what else would he be doing then you have totally proven that you don't know **** cause according to you we should not be looking at the "what if's" in the situation which would be exactly what we would be doing...now you tell me that if it was not a pursuit then why in the world is the other biker not sueing the department for hitting him??? hhmmmm
05-23-2010, 07:30 PM
#117
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How can YOU say he was trying to erase the video?? Please explain.
I think it's pretty safe to say that if you are familiar with the In Car Video System, you are aware that the video CANNOT be erased from the car. If I was involved in that incident, I too would have wanted to replay the video before it got secured into evidence.
I think it's pretty safe to say that if you are familiar with the In Car Video System, you are aware that the video CANNOT be erased from the car. If I was involved in that incident, I too would have wanted to replay the video before it got secured into evidence.
05-23-2010, 08:29 PM
#118
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Do you have any clue and I mean any clue how a police department runs??? NOPE!!! You have based all your answers on this specific event...cops watch video's of a ton of different scenarios as part of their training...they talk about "what if's" all the time to further their training and to help prepare them for situations they might encounter on the street...I am sorry to say this but when you say they are expected to make the right decision every single time...you are being very unrealistic as cops are not robots...they are human beings if you didn't know that and they will make mistakes...no human is above that statement...even you!!! (don't even play cause you don't know how you would react because adrenaline in different situations makes you react differently in certain situations) you prolly would have shot twice!!! As for your opening comment in the first post...you are not the say all know all of the world
If that cop was convinced he had reason for major concern, explain why he parked as he did? Explain why he left his siren on, making it almost impossible for anyone to hear his commands. Explain why he fired a round before the rider ever spoke to him. Explain why he shot an unarmed man. Most of all at this point, explain why he tried to erase his video tape evidence... HE knew he was wrong, end of story.
Police departments run off statistics...he parked his car and had his sirens on because statistically when a biker stops in a pursuit situation he jumps off and runs...so cop was jumping out ready to run after him...the rider appeared to be reaching for a gun...if you read earlier postings you would have read that he testified that he rewinded it to see what just happened...it was not proven that he was rewinding the tape to erase it...now if you try to tell me to think about it and say what else would he be doing then you have totally proven that you don't know **** cause according to you we should not be looking at the "what if's" in the situation which would be exactly what we would be doing...now you tell me that if it was not a pursuit then why in the world is the other biker not sueing the department for hitting him??? hhmmmm
If that cop was convinced he had reason for major concern, explain why he parked as he did? Explain why he left his siren on, making it almost impossible for anyone to hear his commands. Explain why he fired a round before the rider ever spoke to him. Explain why he shot an unarmed man. Most of all at this point, explain why he tried to erase his video tape evidence... HE knew he was wrong, end of story.
Police departments run off statistics...he parked his car and had his sirens on because statistically when a biker stops in a pursuit situation he jumps off and runs...so cop was jumping out ready to run after him...the rider appeared to be reaching for a gun...if you read earlier postings you would have read that he testified that he rewinded it to see what just happened...it was not proven that he was rewinding the tape to erase it...now if you try to tell me to think about it and say what else would he be doing then you have totally proven that you don't know **** cause according to you we should not be looking at the "what if's" in the situation which would be exactly what we would be doing...now you tell me that if it was not a pursuit then why in the world is the other biker not sueing the department for hitting him??? hhmmmm
APG... You WILL be surprised to find out how many cops still don't know it cannot simply be erased or recorded over... I won't get into details of the system, because my information is likely outdated now, but suffice to say... MANY cops simply have no idea what their in car camera is doing, aside from recording... And it does much more in most cases, than simply run in record mode. That cop, however, should've known he couldn't erase the video... I read a report(story) that one of his co-workers openly said this cop thought his recorder would copy something else over the existing "tape."
05-24-2010, 04:17 PM
#119
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Pssst... I know what I'm talking about because I have actual experience and have actually arrested people, but never shot at anyone. That FORMER cop was wrong and now he's a convict. Most cops NEVER make such a stupid mistake, let alone the several he made, in any one stop. I would know, not only from personal experience, but because there have been cops in my family since 1956... We've MET! Now go'way boy, ya bother me.
APG... You WILL be surprised to find out how many cops still don't know it cannot simply be erased or recorded over... I won't get into details of the system, because my information is likely outdated now, but suffice to say... MANY cops simply have no idea what their in car camera is doing, aside from recording... And it does much more in most cases, than simply run in record mode. That cop, however, should've known he couldn't erase the video... I read a report(story) that one of his co-workers openly said this cop thought his recorder would copy something else over the existing "tape."
APG... You WILL be surprised to find out how many cops still don't know it cannot simply be erased or recorded over... I won't get into details of the system, because my information is likely outdated now, but suffice to say... MANY cops simply have no idea what their in car camera is doing, aside from recording... And it does much more in most cases, than simply run in record mode. That cop, however, should've known he couldn't erase the video... I read a report(story) that one of his co-workers openly said this cop thought his recorder would copy something else over the existing "tape."
05-24-2010, 04:38 PM
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pppsssssstttttt hey girl listen up just cause you have family history in the line of duty don't mean ****...see alot of their family members get busted for various criminal activitie's...what's your family hiding??? Or more importantly what are you hiding??? Obviously this cop in the video just proved that not all cops have brains...also were you the one running away from the gun fight??? just curious...
You've gone from saying that I have no clue, to basically, 'Well, just because you do, it doesn't mean anything!!!' All the while, it's you who has no clue, and has never been remotely involved... To top it off, you're trying to talk down to others when you have only a slight grasp of our language yourself. Way to go, bozo. You really ARE a clown! Who knew?? That's enough, really. You're embarrassing yourself, even though you don't seem to know it, yet.
