4l60e drilling spacer plate
05-19-2021, 11:15 AM
#1
4l60e drilling spacer plate Fellas, I知 putting together a pretty stout build for a buddy of mine for his turbo truck. It has everything you can do except the sonnax 6 pinion carrier set. I知 at the point where I知 doing some drilling of spacer plate holes and I had a question. Below in the pic is what I致e drilled it so far. The ones circled are in question to whether I should drill or not. Opinion? I chose to drill the 1-2 on the smaller side because the 1-2 hits pretty hard in my car and this guy will have a tighter converter than I have.
parts list for those interested:
sonnax billet input and output shafts
sonnax hd reaction shaft
4l79 drum with gpz 3-4 clutches
carbon wide band
billet 2-4 servo
billet pinless accumulator pistons
sealed servo pin
beast shell
sonnax had 2-3 shift valve
kolene forward steels
sonnax heavy duty over run clutch hub
.500 boost valve
hp pump spring
freshly machined pump
input drum reinforcement kit
blue molded pistons
etc etc
parts list for those interested:
sonnax billet input and output shafts
sonnax hd reaction shaft
4l79 drum with gpz 3-4 clutches
carbon wide band
billet 2-4 servo
billet pinless accumulator pistons
sealed servo pin
beast shell
sonnax had 2-3 shift valve
kolene forward steels
sonnax heavy duty over run clutch hub
.500 boost valve
hp pump spring
freshly machined pump
input drum reinforcement kit
blue molded pistons
etc etc
05-19-2021, 01:16 PM
#2
TECH Junkie
what you have labeled .110---2-3 shift---too small
what you have labeled .082---1-2 shift---will be fine
what you have labeled .092---band release---too small
two holes circled bottom left...don't touch them--they are holes for the bias oil in the AFL and TCC Reg...leaving them small will keep pressure up for both. Don't mess with 'em
hole top right...that's the low/rev clutch apply. Not really a big deal unless you plan on doing a bunch of 2-1 manual downshifts
I see no mention of drilling feed hole for the 3-4 shift
Did you block accumulator? Did you drill?
what you have labeled .082---1-2 shift---will be fine
what you have labeled .092---band release---too small
two holes circled bottom left...don't touch them--they are holes for the bias oil in the AFL and TCC Reg...leaving them small will keep pressure up for both. Don't mess with 'em
hole top right...that's the low/rev clutch apply. Not really a big deal unless you plan on doing a bunch of 2-1 manual downshifts
I see no mention of drilling feed hole for the 3-4 shift
Did you block accumulator? Did you drill?
05-19-2021, 02:09 PM
#3
what you have labeled .110---2-3 shift---too small
what you have labeled .082---1-2 shift---will be fine perfect
what you have labeled .092---band release---too small
two holes circled bottom left...don't touch them--they are holes for the bias oil in the AFL and TCC Reg...leaving them small will keep pressure up for both. Don't mess with 'em noted!
hole top right...that's the low/rev clutch apply. Not really a big deal unless you plan on doing a bunch of 2-1 manual downshifts nah, I’ll leave that alone then
I see no mention of drilling feed hole for the 3-4 shift
Did you block accumulator? Did you drill?
what you have labeled .082---1-2 shift---will be fine perfect
what you have labeled .092---band release---too small
two holes circled bottom left...don't touch them--they are holes for the bias oil in the AFL and TCC Reg...leaving them small will keep pressure up for both. Don't mess with 'em noted!
hole top right...that's the low/rev clutch apply. Not really a big deal unless you plan on doing a bunch of 2-1 manual downshifts nah, I’ll leave that alone then
I see no mention of drilling feed hole for the 3-4 shift
Did you block accumulator? Did you drill?
i didn’t do anything with the 3-4 shift. I do not believe in using overdrive for anything except cruising. If needs to shift to overdrive, a gear change will be made. But I am open to your reasoning and recommendation.
did not do anything with the accumulator. Open to your suggestions. I do not want a harsh shift tho. I’m trying to avoid things that cause an overly harsh shift. Quick and firm I’m ok with.
what do you suggest for the 2-3 feed hole? Band release? Im all ears!
and thx!
Last edited by Kfxguy; 05-19-2021 at 02:14 PM.
05-19-2021, 02:31 PM
#4
TECH Junkie
you say pretty stout build...and have a parts list that suggests that is true
how stout?
What RPM Range
What converter
how stout?
What RPM Range
What converter
05-19-2021, 02:57 PM
#5
rpm is probably gonna be around 7000
05-19-2021, 03:23 PM
#6
TECH Junkie
A: 3rd Feed
B: 2nd Feed
C: 3rd Exhaust
D: Low-Reverse Feed
E: 4th Feed
F: Check-Ball #2
G: 3rd Accumulator (Band Release)
6: Check-Ball #4
7: Overrun Feed
8: Reverse Input Feed
9: TCC
10: AFL
11: Forward Feed
12: Accumulator Valve-Train
Last edited by vorteciroc; 05-19-2021 at 03:54 PM.
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bbond105 (05-19-2021)
05-19-2021, 03:25 PM
#7
TECH Junkie
.156 2-3
.110 band release
Be sure he is driving in D3 anytime he wants to be hard on it
Block the 4th accumulator with a setscrew, omit the piston and spring, and omit the checkball in the case
I'd also omit the #6 check ball in the valve body
are you blocking 3-2 downshift valves?
I'm assuming you're doing all of the "leak fix" methods.
Abuse bore plugs. O ring end plugs. Blocking TCC reg valve outboard. vacuum testing the rest.
p.s. throw away the kolene fwd steels.
and make sure the 3rd accum checkball is in good shape. The stock capsule and ball is fine as long as it is leak free.
You can use the superior brand replacement if you wish, but a stock capsule is OK too.
.110 band release
Be sure he is driving in D3 anytime he wants to be hard on it
Block the 4th accumulator with a setscrew, omit the piston and spring, and omit the checkball in the case
I'd also omit the #6 check ball in the valve body
are you blocking 3-2 downshift valves?
I'm assuming you're doing all of the "leak fix" methods.
Abuse bore plugs. O ring end plugs. Blocking TCC reg valve outboard. vacuum testing the rest.
p.s. throw away the kolene fwd steels.
and make sure the 3rd accum checkball is in good shape. The stock capsule and ball is fine as long as it is leak free.
You can use the superior brand replacement if you wish, but a stock capsule is OK too.
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bbond105 (05-19-2021)
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05-19-2021, 03:51 PM
#8
TECH Junkie
On my Plate Diagram, The following Holes are only modified for special scenarios:
-F
-6
-8
-9
-10
-12
-F
-6
-8
-9
-10
-12
05-19-2021, 04:15 PM
#9
TECH Junkie
F and 6 are checkball holes that you can block and then force control only through an orifice in both flow directions
9/10/12 are all bias oil that acts on the back side of a valve
9 is the TCC reg bais oil orifice ...assuming the valve is not pinned outboard...will reduce TCC reg oil pressure. (not good imo)
if the valve is pinned then drilling it larger doesn't do much...unless there is a leak in the valve endplug...then you're just puking more fluid for no real reason
10 is the afl bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase feedback volume and effectively reduce AFL oil pressure. I can't see a single benefit to this unless you've found yourself having an uncontrolled AFL pressure rise situation...which across many combos...I have yet to experience.
12 is the accumulator valve bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase bias oil...which will reduce accumulator oil feed...reducing its pressure...and softening shifts
peening the hole smaller will have the opposite effect and will firm shifts. If you are messing with this hole, you're likely deep into the weeds of chasing a very specific shift feel behavior. A feel that 98% of builders won't even pick up on, let alone know how to properly modify to adjust feel.
the reverse oil feed hole #8 is typically .100 or larger. Making this larger will firm the "parking lot shift" from park to reverse. Or neutral to reverse.
for most applications, this really won't need much modification.
I do some weird stuff with the reverse drum and modify it in such a way that it ends up benefiting from .110 or larger feed there. But for the typical build...if it is .100 or larger just leave it alone and you'll not have any issues.
9/10/12 are all bias oil that acts on the back side of a valve
9 is the TCC reg bais oil orifice ...assuming the valve is not pinned outboard...will reduce TCC reg oil pressure. (not good imo)
if the valve is pinned then drilling it larger doesn't do much...unless there is a leak in the valve endplug...then you're just puking more fluid for no real reason
10 is the afl bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase feedback volume and effectively reduce AFL oil pressure. I can't see a single benefit to this unless you've found yourself having an uncontrolled AFL pressure rise situation...which across many combos...I have yet to experience.
12 is the accumulator valve bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase bias oil...which will reduce accumulator oil feed...reducing its pressure...and softening shifts
peening the hole smaller will have the opposite effect and will firm shifts. If you are messing with this hole, you're likely deep into the weeds of chasing a very specific shift feel behavior. A feel that 98% of builders won't even pick up on, let alone know how to properly modify to adjust feel.
the reverse oil feed hole #8 is typically .100 or larger. Making this larger will firm the "parking lot shift" from park to reverse. Or neutral to reverse.
for most applications, this really won't need much modification.
I do some weird stuff with the reverse drum and modify it in such a way that it ends up benefiting from .110 or larger feed there. But for the typical build...if it is .100 or larger just leave it alone and you'll not have any issues.
05-19-2021, 04:38 PM
#10
TECH Junkie
F and 6 are checkball holes that you can block and then force control only through an orifice in both flow directions
9/10/12 are all bias oil that acts on the back side of a valve
9 is the TCC reg bais oil orifice ...assuming the valve is not pinned outboard...will reduce TCC reg oil pressure. (not good imo)
if the valve is pinned then drilling it larger doesn't do much...unless there is a leak in the valve endplug...then you're just puking more fluid for no real reason
10 is the afl bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase feedback volume and effectively reduce AFL oil pressure. I can't see a single benefit to this unless you've found yourself having an uncontrolled AFL pressure rise situation...which across many combos...I have yet to experience.
12 is the accumulator valve bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase bias oil...which will reduce accumulator oil feed...reducing its pressure...and softening shifts
peening the hole smaller will have the opposite effect and will firm shifts. If you are messing with this hole, you're likely deep into the weeds of chasing a very specific shift feel behavior. A feel that 98% of builders won't even pick up on, let alone know how to properly modify to adjust feel.
the reverse oil feed hole #8 is typically .100 or larger. Making this larger will firm the "parking lot shift" from park to reverse. Or neutral to reverse.
for most applications, this really won't need much modification.
I do some weird stuff with the reverse drum and modify it in such a way that it ends up benefiting from .110 or larger feed there. But for the typical build...if it is .100 or larger just leave it alone and you'll not have any issues.
9/10/12 are all bias oil that acts on the back side of a valve
9 is the TCC reg bais oil orifice ...assuming the valve is not pinned outboard...will reduce TCC reg oil pressure. (not good imo)
if the valve is pinned then drilling it larger doesn't do much...unless there is a leak in the valve endplug...then you're just puking more fluid for no real reason
10 is the afl bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase feedback volume and effectively reduce AFL oil pressure. I can't see a single benefit to this unless you've found yourself having an uncontrolled AFL pressure rise situation...which across many combos...I have yet to experience.
12 is the accumulator valve bias oil orifice. Drilling it larger will increase bias oil...which will reduce accumulator oil feed...reducing its pressure...and softening shifts
peening the hole smaller will have the opposite effect and will firm shifts. If you are messing with this hole, you're likely deep into the weeds of chasing a very specific shift feel behavior. A feel that 98% of builders won't even pick up on, let alone know how to properly modify to adjust feel.
the reverse oil feed hole #8 is typically .100 or larger. Making this larger will firm the "parking lot shift" from park to reverse. Or neutral to reverse.
for most applications, this really won't need much modification.
I do some weird stuff with the reverse drum and modify it in such a way that it ends up benefiting from .110 or larger feed there. But for the typical build...if it is .100 or larger just leave it alone and you'll not have any issues.
Quit spoiling all of my Posts!
05-19-2021, 09:18 PM
#12
TECH Junkie
You are Most Welcome Kfxguy!
I enjoy seeing you and other members Post their build Threads with information that was learned in these Forums!
There is a great amount of good information here in the Automatic Transmission Forum!
Even from Maroon Monster (who loves to snipe Posts before I Post them myself)
I enjoy seeing you and other members Post their build Threads with information that was learned in these Forums!
There is a great amount of good information here in the Automatic Transmission Forum!
Even from Maroon Monster (who loves to snipe Posts before I Post them myself)
05-19-2021, 09:35 PM
#13
You are Most Welcome Kfxguy!
I enjoy seeing you and other members Post their build Threads with information that was learned in these Forums!
There is a great amount of good information here in the Automatic Transmission Forum!
Even from Maroon Monster (who loves to snipe Posts before I Post them myself)
I enjoy seeing you and other members Post their build Threads with information that was learned in these Forums!
There is a great amount of good information here in the Automatic Transmission Forum!
Even from Maroon Monster (who loves to snipe Posts before I Post them myself)
i might post the next build. It痴 gonna be for a vette. I have t had much time lately to post my builds.....but building I have been doing. Just finished building another turbo car, that was a 6 month project.
05-19-2021, 11:12 PM
#14
TECH Junkie
the reverse oil feed hole #8...
I do some weird stuff with the reverse drum and modify it in such a way that it ends up benefiting from .110 or larger feed there. But for the typical build...if it is .100 or larger just leave it alone and you'll not have any issues.
Just curious.
05-20-2021, 08:25 AM
#15
TECH Junkie
I have that weird stuff out there in multiple units.
centrifugal apply in the reverse drum is no joke in low gear
especially with anything remotely fast
transgo tries to remedy it but I'm not a fan of how they do it
centrifugal apply in the reverse drum is no joke in low gear
especially with anything remotely fast
transgo tries to remedy it but I'm not a fan of how they do it
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Kfxguy (05-20-2021)
05-20-2021, 09:59 AM
#18
TECH Junkie
add away
05-20-2021, 06:01 PM
#20
TECH Junkie
-Do not plug the Holes in the Reverse-Input Piston.
-Use Early THM700-R4 Waved Steel Plate
-Use Early THM700-R4 Frictions
-Use Late 4L60E Turbulator Steels
-Use corresponding Selective Backing-Plate
-Use a set of Trans-Brake Springs in the Reverse-Input Drum with a 0.035" Bleed Hole in the corner of the Drum.