Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

It's a hard show to produce is my take. I know how I would do it differently, based on watching an episode and my talks with 3-4 of the show staff.

I'd have teams build a car for a race, with some parameters. I'd still race for titles, but I'd emphasize the team aspect even more, and I'd get folks to build $20,000 cars.

BADSZ28

iTrader: (39)

43 pages! OMG!

Well I hope in the long run everything irons out ok.

BigDaddyBry

iTrader: (15)

I'm guessing the main reason is because its illegal, doesn't set a good precedent for the show, and sends the wrong message.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I sent my title in, the BOC guy did not. I talked to him this week.

Bry, the show does have a process in place so that they are not violating any gambling laws. The show can only be held in certain states too as I understand it. But that's all their business and if they feel like discussing it, it's up to them.

Me offering to race for money was something we decided, and it was outside of the spirit of the show. They do race for titles on the show. But when our opponent who had a same year car (2000 Mustang) dropped out, it all went kapoot. We went from having two cars that would have weighed about the same, that were both pretty nice cars, with the same limitations and advantages, to something completely different. But it happens all the time for shows like that, folks blow their cars up and then can't make it. I'm sure that the staff on the show has told Nate to get the nicest, coolest cars possible. To maybe the senior folks on the show, the late model GM vs. Ford aspect of our race was not maybe that interesting to them, but that was the whole underlying premise of our race. No biggie at this point, we will move on and race the car at events for the site.

JOHN

cam

iTrader: (9)

I would have loved to see the episode go down. Its a TV show for crying out loud not the World Series its just supposed to be entertaining enough for folks to park their asses in front of the tube for 30 mins or and hr whatever.

I say check your attitudes ( PSJ your solid bro i respect your calmness ) but to others involved and get it done for another episode. For the producers its all about money and I'm sure "that show" would love to have the HUGE viewer-ship that the original episode would have garnished. I couldn't agree more though it needs to be another car that at least is similar in prep and appearance and whatnot and the Ford vs GM thing is pure GOLD for attention/controversy etc. Heck if Van Halen can get together with Roth again surely you guys can make it happen.

As for all the trash talking and whatnot? Pretty juvenile... Mark Twain said it best. Its best to stand silent and look like a fool than open your mouth and prove it.

One more thing... If I ( and I know I'm not alone here ) find out that the title is not returned it should be noted that there is a lot of people following this so dont "bitch out" and TRY to steal the car. Justice has a funny way of sorting itself out one way or another

Good luck with it all boys.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I expect the title back in a few days, that's a simple fact. I also gave them my FEDEX account number so it's on my dime. I will let you all know when I receive it.

LS1curious

My take on on it is that If you really didn't want to race you should have backed out when your original opponent backed out weeks ago. That would have been much simpler then showing up and running off like a scared puppy.I saw the car get trailered in and then trailed out.

It would have been fiarly easy to go ahead and find another site to line up against. Maybe not easy in the sense that it would have been as fast of a line up but at least you could have found a different opponent.

Zangel

iTrader: (11)

How exactly did we run off "like a scared puppy" when we offered up money and I personally told Rich we would race any vehicle he could put us up against that weekend for pinks. No one got scared. We just wanted a fair race. When we realized there was a 10.5 cap (no matter what the vehicles run), then we got the assurance that their "8.80" car wouldn't be able to just walk off and leave us. There was some miscommunication in the beginning. However, when it came down to it, we were ready to race but some of their guys took things very personal and wouldn't let us in. The end... not so hard to understand.

kp

iTrader: (34)

So they made you send it in first and not the other guy? If you didnt sign it just apply for a lost title, takes a few weeks and if the title is in your name you dont need one unless you sell it anyhow.

LS1curious

Does this really require more discussion. As soon as you tried to arrange a buy back before the race you breached contract.

Sean

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

LS1curious. you are wrong. We did not like how things were going with the replacement Mustang. I offered to race the Bu when we were talking to Rich, Kail, Bob and Adam. I have about 20 witnesses, so when you say 'scared puppy' you are just throwing words out there and not painting an accurate picture. You were not involved so I don't expect you to have all the information, and it's really up to you if you want to attack us, but I really don't care. You were not in the conversations. It's like your MI vs MI races. I was not involved but saw the races. So I cannot comment because it was not my deal.

I am not going to argue about this endlessely for a couple of weeks, no matter how hard some folks try to keep fanning the flames. Once I have my title back, it's over.

White_Hawk

iTrader: (3)

Obviously you didn't see the Motown Muscle vs Michigan Speed race that was filmed Friday night. The producers, crew, Rich, and Nate said it was one of the most exciting shows they ever filmed. That's OK, though, because you can see it in February and decide for yourself...

-Geoff

Zangel

iTrader: (11)

What contract? Oh, you mean the one that we were supposed to sign but never got the chance?!? We can't breach a contract if we never had a chance to sign the contract.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I won't disagree with you Sean, though it would be the 'spirit' of the contract since I never saw it. You've made your feelings known, a few times, I get it. You were not in our meeting with their staff, so you are missing out on the entire conversation. Rich asked me if I would own up to offering cash, and I said yes. I also offered to race the Bu AND the replacement Mustang if he gave us his word that he would keep it fair. He gave us his word, but some of the producers said things had already moved forward. Ask Rich or Kail if you want. We also offered to go to the track as an alternate. The honest to God's truth is that we brought a car that fit the rules, and that we had no trust in the whole thing once we heard what the other car ran. I mean come on, he was as fast as us on motor as we are on spray. We cannot safely grab both kits on the car, we never tested it on the track and it looked lean on the dyno. A big part of the hotel meeting was videotaped but we are not going to post it.

LS1curious

Thank you for finally owning up to the truth about Why the crew would not let you back on the track. You cannot preaarange any deals prior to racing It was in the paper work you sent in with your title. Give it read over.

Now that this is in the open I will let it go. Have a nice Day PSJ see you in Memphis.

Redhound157

Why would you even drive down there to back out. the mustang ran a 10.2 on motor. You could ahve got lengths and NOS basiclly anything you wanted. And another thing why would you boys go to the RV that the guys with the mustang was in and ask if they won can you buy the car back? That defeats the purpose of you even being down there. talk about keeping it fair... those guy would have done anything to make it a fair race, those guys just wanted to race unlike you. They were not afraid of losen there car, you might say ya because it was a POS but what yall don't know is they had a week and a half to build they're car from scratch, there was about 8 grand in the motor alone. Yea it blew but hey sometimes the motor will hold and sometimes it won't. A week and a half worken after hours b/c there Boss wouldn't let them work on it till after 6 PM. Now do you think you could do any better?

That Malibu never fired up the engine till the day of the race, those guys knew that Westend Motors had something but hey they were there to RACE. If you weren't willing to hand over them keys and title then you should have never tried to get on the Show. I just can't believe that yall had the gall to go to those guys and ask to buy back the car i don't see how that wouldn't have tore your pride all to hell. Sounds like to me yall were scared I don't know about the rest of you guy.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I offered to swap up the race and run the Bu, which I was told made some passes during the day on Friday, and folks said it looked fast.

In the end that older 87 Mustang got a race and the rest is history. They raced like an 80 Bu which is more like their car. I don't want to talk about the older Mustang, it was never our plan to run that car until it was changed at the last minute.

I already posted above about our actual conversation with the show staff, so I am not going to post it again, just read my last 10 posts or so. Call up any of the staff and ask them.

Zangel

iTrader: (11)

Lets not pretend that we were the first to talk about a buy back or money race. I personally know vehicles that have purchased their vehicles back on that show and no one bats an eye. The only reason this became a problem THIS time is because feelings were hurt. Someone decided to throw a fit and used this as an excuse. Fair huh? Why would you bring an 8 second car to a 10 second race if that was the case. Sounds fair to me... I recall someone saying that they would make no concessions and the other car would not have to take the bottle out once we started the race. So basically, we were getting screwed because they had already decided the fate of the race. Again, sounds pretty fair to me. I'm glad to see that you can put together a car fast. That's great! Not sure what it has to do with anything but congrats. Give me the parts and I can do the same thing. It wasn't about being scared of losing our car. It was about not going out there and looking like a fool because we didn't realize that when they said bring a 10.5 car, they meant bring an 8 second car.

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

The first race on Friday was entirely conducted on a 10.5 basis.

When I am told by a show to bring a 10.5 combo, I do. We brought the slips to prove it. After all, when both sides are supposed to bring a 10.5, there is a bracket race like element to the structure right? How else would they achieve any sort of parity. They spec'd 11.0 last year btw. I'm not mad at the Mustang guys. But for the record, we all know that races are pointless when one car has the other one covered by 15-25 car lengths. We made a point of trying to keep things fair. I ALSO offered to have us run on bottle and have them run their 10.2 motor (this was to the show staff, before we talked to the Mustang guys), and we'd agree to a 9.9 ET and 135mph max cap. Meaning if we run that fast or quick we lose the round. How fair is that? I also suggested a 10.4 breakout. Again, none if this happened. I had a ton of flexibility as long as we built in some fairness. I have 20 witnesses on just about every conversation, including a long vid from the hotel lobby. It's all there. No biggie, I can move on.

Jon5212

iTrader: (2)

I'm sorry to PSJ and all the other crew that worked HARD on this car and this trying to put this show together. I was extremely excited to see something like this show go down... the way it was meant to. Two long time rivals in the muscle car industry Ford and Chevy, showcasing the NEW technology these cars offer and what they are capable of. PSJ the Pinks car is just plain awesome. The decisions made to not go forth with the show are completely acceptable to me, this was business and it was not going right, so the choice was made correctly. I can't wait to see the car in some more events. PSJ, if you could send me a PM sometime when you got a chance... I would like to know what it takes to get into the aftermarket performance of these cars... what general schooling is sought after stuff like that. I live in Indianapolis and I am really not sure how big of a market my area is for this. I've worked in sales before and would love to be a sales rep for an aftermarket shop/company. Sorry a little off topic, just wanted to give you props.