My first single turbo build
01-20-2019, 06:00 AM
#221
10 Second Club
iTrader: (2)
I've tried to tell you since the beginning the GTO is not the kind of car to do a "junk yard" build with. I've had a couple of them I run hundreds of passes on and probably over 100 passes in the 10.2 to 10.3x range and daily driven. My current car I've only ran in the 1/8th down to 7.1x on 10 psi. Now of course those aren't fast times compared to most here, but you have to pay to play with these cars. I've always taken the buy once cry once philosophy with driveline parts. Sure anything can break, but you can't cheap out on driveline parts in a heavy IRS car. Lots of 300m billet stuff whether it be in the trans or axle stubs/cv's.
While the GTO is not the best choice for drag racing and certainly not with how fast everyone has gotten now, going 10's or even mid 9's really isn't out of the question while still maintaining streetability. You just have to decide if you want to do this with a GTO you have to put good stuff in the driveline or you will be constantly fixing stuff. You will end up doing it several times until you end up with the stuff you should have put in it originally.
As for the motor since you have a lot of things going on now financially with the car, I'd go ahead and forge the motor while you're down. Get that driveline built and forged motor along with a better fuel system and run 9's easy with your turbo setup. That may all take a year financially, but it will be worth it in the long term over continually breaking stuff if you don't. The other option is put the car back together stock, sell it, and build a different platform.
Sorry to sound negative, but I can tell you what you want to hear or tell you what I really think.
While the GTO is not the best choice for drag racing and certainly not with how fast everyone has gotten now, going 10's or even mid 9's really isn't out of the question while still maintaining streetability. You just have to decide if you want to do this with a GTO you have to put good stuff in the driveline or you will be constantly fixing stuff. You will end up doing it several times until you end up with the stuff you should have put in it originally.
As for the motor since you have a lot of things going on now financially with the car, I'd go ahead and forge the motor while you're down. Get that driveline built and forged motor along with a better fuel system and run 9's easy with your turbo setup. That may all take a year financially, but it will be worth it in the long term over continually breaking stuff if you don't. The other option is put the car back together stock, sell it, and build a different platform.
Sorry to sound negative, but I can tell you what you want to hear or tell you what I really think.
01-20-2019, 11:01 AM
#222
I've tried to tell you since the beginning the GTO is not the kind of car to do a "junk yard" build with. I've had a couple of them I run hundreds of passes on and probably over 100 passes in the 10.2 to 10.3x range and daily driven. My current car I've only ran in the 1/8th down to 7.1x on 10 psi. Now of course those aren't fast times compared to most here, but you have to pay to play with these cars. I've always taken the buy once cry once philosophy with driveline parts. Sure anything can break, but you can't cheap out on driveline parts in a heavy IRS car. Lots of 300m billet stuff whether it be in the trans or axle stubs/cv's.
While the GTO is not the best choice for drag racing and certainly not with how fast everyone has gotten now, going 10's or even mid 9's really isn't out of the question while still maintaining streetability. You just have to decide if you want to do this with a GTO you have to put good stuff in the driveline or you will be constantly fixing stuff. You will end up doing it several times until you end up with the stuff you should have put in it originally.
As for the motor since you have a lot of things going on now financially with the car, I'd go ahead and forge the motor while you're down. Get that driveline built and forged motor along with a better fuel system and run 9's easy with your turbo setup. That may all take a year financially, but it will be worth it in the long term over continually breaking stuff if you don't. The other option is put the car back together stock, sell it, and build a different platform.
Sorry to sound negative, but I can tell you what you want to hear or tell you what I really think.
While the GTO is not the best choice for drag racing and certainly not with how fast everyone has gotten now, going 10's or even mid 9's really isn't out of the question while still maintaining streetability. You just have to decide if you want to do this with a GTO you have to put good stuff in the driveline or you will be constantly fixing stuff. You will end up doing it several times until you end up with the stuff you should have put in it originally.
As for the motor since you have a lot of things going on now financially with the car, I'd go ahead and forge the motor while you're down. Get that driveline built and forged motor along with a better fuel system and run 9's easy with your turbo setup. That may all take a year financially, but it will be worth it in the long term over continually breaking stuff if you don't. The other option is put the car back together stock, sell it, and build a different platform.
Sorry to sound negative, but I can tell you what you want to hear or tell you what I really think.
After thinking about it overnight and calming down a bit, and reading blackbirds post, I’m gonna build the trans, and yank the heads off. I have another motor I’m building so instead of wasting time and money on this engine, I’ll just wait. I learned a lesson at the track so for now on I’ll keep the boost low in first gear and have it ramp in more easily instead of all of a sudden. I’ll be upgrading drivetrain while I’m building the other engine.
The gto isnt isn’t the greatest platform for building a drag car, I agree. But my purpose is really not a drag car. It’s more a comfortable driver that is decently fast. I don’t plan on going to the strip often at all with it, I just wanted my time slip. Mid to high tens in something I can drive anywhere isn’t to bad even tho there’s much faster cars out there.....but most people don’t drive those cars as much as I drive mine. Theres always exceptions of course.
01-20-2019, 02:07 PM
#223
10 Second Club
iTrader: (2)
After thinking about it overnight and calming down a bit, and reading blackbirds post, I’m gonna build the trans, and yank the heads off. I have another motor I’m building so instead of wasting time and money on this engine, I’ll just wait. I learned a lesson at the track so for now on I’ll keep the boost low in first gear and have it ramp in more easily instead of all of a sudden. I’ll be upgrading drivetrain while I’m building the other engine.
The gto isnt isn’t the greatest platform for building a drag car, I agree. But my purpose is really not a drag car. It’s more a comfortable driver that is decently fast. I don’t plan on going to the strip often at all with it, I just wanted my time slip. Mid to high tens in something I can drive anywhere isn’t to bad even tho there’s much faster cars out there.....but most people don’t drive those cars as much as I drive mine. Theres always exceptions of course.
01-20-2019, 11:02 PM
#224
Yep, sometimes after a breakage or set back our first reaction is to throw in the towel. Take your time and build it right don't short cut to get it back out only to have something else break which will cost you more money in the long run. The thing with a GTO is it's rarity and how nice they are. There are no style points, but I refuse to build an ls swapped fox body even though I'd be faster for cheaper. You will have no problem being faster than your goal if you take your time and build it right. I think you can make 9 second power with the right fuel and tuning you just need the driveline to handle it. While not a junk yard build I've been looking at a 347 iron block forged rod/piston short blocks for around $2600-2800 which isn't bad. Pair that with some budget PRC as cast heads, ls6 intake, jam cam for a centri, and all of the boost for 9 second power even in a GTO.
01-26-2019, 10:23 PM
#225
Little update. After consulting with my buddy who builds ls cars for a living, I decided not to pull the engine out. I didn’t feel like messing with the ac anyways. He told me that if I take the rod bolts out that he wouldn’t reuse them. And he wouldn’t reuse the bearings either. He said they have a small amount of crush to them. So i did some research and it can go both ways. Some people had no issues, some spun a rod bearing in a short time and some had a window in the block. So I decided to leave it alone. I did pull the heads today and put ls9 head gaskets on it. He told me the ls1 gaskets would last for a while but the ls9 would likely last longer. So I picked up a set of those. I also figured if have the coolant out of it and the thing half apart, why not put a milder turbo cam in it? I scored a summit racing ghost cam from Mavn so I figured why not do it now? I also bought arp rocker arm bolts a while back so those will be going on too. I should have the engine back together tomorrow, I got a late start today and I finished the heads and called it a night. Now for a couple pics.
the wife wasn’t happy about this when she walked outside lmao!!
Can you see how the coolant was escaping? That sucks. I’ll never use a graphite gasket again.
here’s my cam card
the wife wasn’t happy about this when she walked outside lmao!!
Can you see how the coolant was escaping? That sucks. I’ll never use a graphite gasket again.
here’s my cam card
01-27-2019, 03:58 PM
#226
What’s nice about the graphite gaskets is they let go before you torch a head. Think of them as the fuse in a shorted wire. MLS are very unforgiving as it’s basically solid metal and thus harder than the aluminum it’s clamped to. So the head goes or the piston before the gasket does.
Looks like u got a lot done!
Looks like u got a lot done!
01-27-2019, 08:37 PM
#227
What’s nice about the graphite gaskets is they let go before you torch a head. Think of them as the fuse in a shorted wire. MLS are very unforgiving as it’s basically solid metal and thus harder than the aluminum it’s clamped to. So the head goes or the piston before the gasket does.
Looks like u got a lot done!
Looks like u got a lot done!
01-27-2019, 08:48 PM
#228
Got a good bit done today. Took my time really. Put the cam in and the whole engine is back together. The only think left is put the passenger shorty header on and the turbo manifold but I need gaskets. None of the parts stores had mls gaskets in stock so I’ll order some tomorrow. While I was putting it back together I addressed some things of concern.
- I heat wrapped the charge pipe going from the intercooler to the throttle body with DEI heat barrier tape. It passes in the hot air that is coming from the radiator fans. Maybe help with heat soak. Maybe not. Can’t hurt.
- I bell mouthed the intercooler inlet from the turbo side charge pipe. This is a really thick intercooler I have and that flat edge was probably about 3/16, my thought is it could possibly get a little turbulent right there, so I radiused it. Can’t hurt either.
- had to cut 1/4” off a huge suspension bolt. Not sure what it is but it faces forward and has a huge bushing. The pipe was lightly kissing it.
-I had to notch a couple areas on the radiator support. It’s a pain in the *** to get the condenser out so I made some extra clearance. Much easier to get it in and out (radiator and condenser ) now.
- cleaned up some wiring and my vacuum hoses.
Im trying to decide if I should put the trans in and then build my down pipe before even running it. I also have a Tial wastegate that needs to go in. And I need to pick up a cutout.
Btw, I’m putting my BTR stage 2 ls1 cam up for sale in the next few days. In case anyone here is interested first.
- I heat wrapped the charge pipe going from the intercooler to the throttle body with DEI heat barrier tape. It passes in the hot air that is coming from the radiator fans. Maybe help with heat soak. Maybe not. Can’t hurt.
- I bell mouthed the intercooler inlet from the turbo side charge pipe. This is a really thick intercooler I have and that flat edge was probably about 3/16, my thought is it could possibly get a little turbulent right there, so I radiused it. Can’t hurt either.
- had to cut 1/4” off a huge suspension bolt. Not sure what it is but it faces forward and has a huge bushing. The pipe was lightly kissing it.
-I had to notch a couple areas on the radiator support. It’s a pain in the *** to get the condenser out so I made some extra clearance. Much easier to get it in and out (radiator and condenser ) now.
- cleaned up some wiring and my vacuum hoses.
Im trying to decide if I should put the trans in and then build my down pipe before even running it. I also have a Tial wastegate that needs to go in. And I need to pick up a cutout.
Btw, I’m putting my BTR stage 2 ls1 cam up for sale in the next few days. In case anyone here is interested first.
02-23-2019, 02:13 PM
#231
Little update. I had the car apart do it got all kinds of love while it was apart. So I mentioned the cam and ls9 head gaskets. I went ahead and changed the flex plate to a heavy duty one which weighs 1lb more. Hope that extra weight stabilizes the idle better. Trying to get it to idle as stable as stock with a touch of lope. Understand that I dropped almost 10lbs if rotating weight when I did the stall. While the flex plate was off I changed the rear gasket and rear main seal. It was leaking. I put my tial wastegate on too.
I just went drove it. So far no issues. I’m extremely surprised because anytime you do this amount of work, something happens. So my initial thoughts are.... it drives better, idles a little better, no fuel smell at idle (wife will appreciate that) it still pulls to 7000rpm and it “feels” like it still pulls just as hard, if not, a little better. I have not touched the tune. Oddly it drives almost perfect. Afr is a tad leaner (15.2) and I’m ok with that. My fuel consumption gauge says it’s using .25 gallons per hour less at idle. I’ll fine tune that shortly. Here’s and idle clip.
I just went drove it. So far no issues. I’m extremely surprised because anytime you do this amount of work, something happens. So my initial thoughts are.... it drives better, idles a little better, no fuel smell at idle (wife will appreciate that) it still pulls to 7000rpm and it “feels” like it still pulls just as hard, if not, a little better. I have not touched the tune. Oddly it drives almost perfect. Afr is a tad leaner (15.2) and I’m ok with that. My fuel consumption gauge says it’s using .25 gallons per hour less at idle. I’ll fine tune that shortly. Here’s and idle clip.
02-24-2019, 10:19 PM
#232
Broke the trans again today. Lol............................................... ........ edit I'm reading back over this thread on 8/23/19 and this is some funny ****! I forgot it ran for only a day and broke the output lololol
Last edited by Kfxguy; 08-23-2019 at 02:12 PM.
02-25-2019, 06:40 AM
#233
TECH Apprentice
02-25-2019, 07:54 AM
#235
TECH Apprentice
hate to say it but you might be at the max for cheap parts . 11.20@125 is quick for a street car . any faster an your either gonna have to upgrade the drive line or build a dedicated drag car . which dont sound like a bad option
02-25-2019, 09:26 AM
#237
my son and i were cruising around yesterday. beautiful day. Had put that cam in i got from Mavn, so i was dialing my tune and my boost in. Car was a good bit stronger than it was before. It would break my drag tires loose at 45mph in second gear om 9lbs. So decided to get into it in second again, and at the top of second get i hear a BAM real loud (like happened at the track) and the car wouldn't pull anymore. the engine ran for a little bit after. wasnt running rough but ended up dying and wouldnt turn over. I coasted about a mile down the road(was going 89mph when it happened) and pulled over in a side road parking lot. Thought it was the engine at first. I saw no oil. no metal in the oil. It wouldnt spin, try to crank and it would make a half revolution and stop. luckey a guy drove up that his kid knew my kid and he had a car trailer right down the road. So he went got it and pulled it home for me. Got home, put a breaker bar on it and forced it to turn. Then i cranked it. motor seemed fine. but it was making all kinds of racket.
02-25-2019, 12:10 PM
#239
I agree, upgrade the driveline. But low 11s and mid 120s isn't anywhere near "dedicated drag car" status.
02-25-2019, 01:04 PM
#240
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (13)
my son and i were cruising around yesterday. beautiful day. Had put that cam in i got from Mavn, so i was dialing my tune and my boost in. Car was a good bit stronger than it was before. It would break my drag tires loose at 45mph in second gear om 9lbs. So decided to get into it in second again, and at the top of second get i hear a BAM real loud (like happened at the track) and the car wouldn't pull anymore. the engine ran for a little bit after. wasnt running rough but ended up dying and wouldnt turn over. I coasted about a mile down the road(was going 89mph when it happened) and pulled over in a side road parking lot. Thought it was the engine at first. I saw no oil. no metal in the oil. It wouldnt spin, try to crank and it would make a half revolution and stop. luckey a guy drove up that his kid knew my kid and he had a car trailer right down the road. So he went got it and pulled it home for me. Got home, put a breaker bar on it and forced it to turn. Then i cranked it. motor seemed fine. but it was making all kinds of racket.