What's needed for 383 setup
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,125
Likes: 4
From: Alexandria, VA
What's needed for 383 setup I'm thinking about going the 383 stroker route. I'm gonna have to bore and resleeve my 99 engine, but that's the least of my worries. I've found that a forged 347 and a eagle 383 rotational assembly will cost the same. But, I'm trying to find out the hidden costs. I'm not looking for the most kick *** 383 in the world, I'm only looking for a better jump on future mods since I can get bigger cubes for the same price of going back to stock. Keep in mind I already have the following:
Brand new:
TR224 cam, Ti retainers, Comp 918's
LS6 ported oil pump
LS6 intake
Double roller chain/gears
I'm gonna be sticking with the stock heads because I don't have the money for better ones at this point so i do realize that is going to be my biggest bottleneck. However, I am absolutely fine with that. I have already planned on getting new lifters and I have someone than can bore/resleeve for me as well as someone that is going to put this all together (very reputable person). So, what else is hidden in this? I'm just trying to get an idea before I make the decision very soon. Please don't hold back... I want to hear everything.
Brand new:
TR224 cam, Ti retainers, Comp 918's
LS6 ported oil pump
LS6 intake
Double roller chain/gears
I'm gonna be sticking with the stock heads because I don't have the money for better ones at this point so i do realize that is going to be my biggest bottleneck. However, I am absolutely fine with that. I have already planned on getting new lifters and I have someone than can bore/resleeve for me as well as someone that is going to put this all together (very reputable person). So, what else is hidden in this? I'm just trying to get an idea before I make the decision very soon. Please don't hold back... I want to hear everything.
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From: Gainesville, Denton TX
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generation-iii-internal-engine/296970-what-my-options-now.html
You've got quite a bit of info in that thread
You've got quite a bit of info in that thread
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,125
Likes: 4
From: Alexandria, VA
Most of that discussion was based on what shortblock people wanted me to get. This thread is focusing on the fact that I am (theoretically) keeping my block and boring it and going with the 383.
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 273
Likes: 1
From: Trois-Rivières (Québec / Canada)
Originally Posted by ArcticZ28
I'm thinking about going the 383 stroker route. I'm gonna have to bore and resleeve my 99 engine, but that's the least of my worries. I've found that a forged 347 and a eagle 383 rotational assembly will cost the same. But, I'm trying to find out the hidden costs. I'm not looking for the most kick *** 383 in the world, I'm only looking for a better jump on future mods since I can get bigger cubes for the same price of going back to stock. Keep in mind I already have the following:
Brand new:
TR224 cam, Ti retainers, Comp 918's
LS6 ported oil pump
LS6 intake
Double roller chain/gears
I'm gonna be sticking with the stock heads because I don't have the money for better ones at this point so i do realize that is going to be my biggest bottleneck. However, I am absolutely fine with that. I have already planned on getting new lifters and I have someone than can bore/resleeve for me as well as someone that is going to put this all together (very reputable person). So, what else is hidden in this? I'm just trying to get an idea before I make the decision very soon. Please don't hold back... I want to hear everything.
Brand new:
TR224 cam, Ti retainers, Comp 918's
LS6 ported oil pump
LS6 intake
Double roller chain/gears
I'm gonna be sticking with the stock heads because I don't have the money for better ones at this point so i do realize that is going to be my biggest bottleneck. However, I am absolutely fine with that. I have already planned on getting new lifters and I have someone than can bore/resleeve for me as well as someone that is going to put this all together (very reputable person). So, what else is hidden in this? I'm just trying to get an idea before I make the decision very soon. Please don't hold back... I want to hear everything.
I've got a 382 with stock (slightly ported) LS1 heads, 10.6:1cr (running 91 octane), lunati 224/.560/112+4 cam (XE lobes), double chain, 918's, LS6 intake, SLP oil pump, SLP 1 3/4 headers, catted-y, oem dual/dual catback.
399rwhp/411rwtq through a centerforce dual-friction clutch, steel driveshaft and Moser 12 bolts (3.73's, 33 spline, posi). The PCM has been retuned since that dyno graph below and I can definitely feel a difference (I'm probably around 410/420 right now).
The car is a blast! Torque is awesome in the low end. Even with 3.73's I've got no traction in 1st and 2nd gear. Only drawback is that it peak a bit too early for my taste, but that's not too bad for a daily driver. Driveability is almost like stock with this cam with no stalling or surging.
My advice however, if your goal is the dragstrip, is to go with a bigger cam. For the street, your TR224 will do the job with stock heads (but I'm sure most guys here will call it a baby cam for a 383
). Launching!
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 273
Likes: 1
From: Trois-Rivières (Québec / Canada)
I almost forgot you original question 
Hidden costs are not the engine by itself. It's everything else that is needed to make the car capable of holding the torque of a 383.
12 bolts or 9" rear end
Driveshaft
Clutch or transmission/converter
suspension mods.
SFC's, STB's, etc...
etc..., etc...
Hidden costs are not the engine by itself. It's everything else that is needed to make the car capable of holding the torque of a 383.
12 bolts or 9" rear end
Driveshaft
Clutch or transmission/converter
suspension mods.
SFC's, STB's, etc...
etc..., etc...
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,125
Likes: 4
From: Alexandria, VA
Originally Posted by Blue Hawk
I almost forgot you original question
Hidden costs are not the engine by itself. It's everything else that is needed to make the car capable of holding the torque of a 383.
12 bolts or 9" rear end
Driveshaft
Clutch or transmission/converter
suspension mods.
SFC's, STB's, etc...
etc..., etc...
Hidden costs are not the engine by itself. It's everything else that is needed to make the car capable of holding the torque of a 383.
12 bolts or 9" rear end
Driveshaft
Clutch or transmission/converter
suspension mods.
SFC's, STB's, etc...
etc..., etc...
Keep em comin guys. Launching!
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 273
Likes: 1
From: Trois-Rivières (Québec / Canada)
Originally Posted by ArcticZ28
That is what I figured, but I just wanted to make sure. I know eventually I'll need a 12 bolt rear and suspension mods. But, right now the focus is the motor. I think I'm gonna need a bore/resleeve because I have a slight scratch in the wall of a cylinder due to broken off valve. But otherwise I would have gone your route of honing. I appreciate the info a lot. I'm glad to hear how much of a success your 383 is Keep em comin guys.
Keep em comin guys.That said, the torque down low would be simply amazing, and it would be a very good base for later upgrades.
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Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,125
Likes: 4
From: Alexandria, VA
Originally Posted by Blue Hawk
Was your piston damaged by the valve? Is that the reason why you want to upgrade to a forged bottom end? In that case, if you do both the stroker and the resleeved block, you will end up with a 422+ cid. Your TR224 will be very tame with so much displacement, and you will be severely limited by your heads and intake (at least for now).
That said, the torque down low would be simply amazing, and it would be a very good base for later upgrades.
That said, the torque down low would be simply amazing, and it would be a very good base for later upgrades.
BTW, what's the math for coming up with the displacement again? Also, how much would I be boring over/resleeving?
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From: Trois-Rivières (Québec / Canada)
Originally Posted by ArcticZ28
The #8 piston was damaged by the valve, and the rest of the pistons were scarred by valve slap. That was my main reason for doing all this. I know I will be limited by all of that, but most of that stuff is brand new (considering i was working with a 346 at first before things went wrong) so I'm going to stay with it for now and get some use out of it.
BTW, what's the math for coming up with the displacement again? Also, how much would I be boring over/resleeving?
BTW, what's the math for coming up with the displacement again? Also, how much would I be boring over/resleeving?
Ex: a 427 (4.125 x 4.000) would be 4.125 x 4.125 x 4.000 x 8 x 0.7854
I think (but I'm not 100% sure, correct me if I'm wrong guys) that right now, a Darton wet sleeve can be bored anywhere from 4.100 to 4.160. And I remember seeing a couple posts here saying that the new Darton sleeve will allow for a 4.200 bore.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,125
Likes: 4
From: Alexandria, VA
Originally Posted by Blue Hawk
cid = bore x bore x stroke x number of cylinder x 0.7854
Ex: a 427 (4.125 x 4.000) would be 4.125 x 4.125 x 4.000 x 8 x 0.7854
I think (but I'm not 100% sure, correct me if I'm wrong guys) that right now, a Darton wet sleeve can be bored anywhere from 4.100 to 4.160. And I remember seeing a couple posts here saying that the new Darton sleeve will allow for a 4.200 bore.
Ex: a 427 (4.125 x 4.000) would be 4.125 x 4.125 x 4.000 x 8 x 0.7854
I think (but I'm not 100% sure, correct me if I'm wrong guys) that right now, a Darton wet sleeve can be bored anywhere from 4.100 to 4.160. And I remember seeing a couple posts here saying that the new Darton sleeve will allow for a 4.200 bore.
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 273
Likes: 1
From: Trois-Rivières (Québec / Canada)
Originally Posted by ArcticZ28
How much should I bore? That's one aspect I'm not too familiar with.
but I'd go with a 4.125 bore / 4.000 stroke kit. That's the most common. I have always tought that having a 427 sounds so much cool! This way, it would left you with plenty of room in the future for another overbore if needed. Many sponsors here are doing 427's. Or you can go all the way to a 4.155 bore / 4.00 stoke and have a 434. Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 5,125
Likes: 4
From: Alexandria, VA
Originally Posted by Blue Hawk
Neither am I but I'd go with a 4.125 bore / 4.000 stroke kit. That's the most common. I have always tought that having a 427 sounds so much cool! This way, it would left you with plenty of room in the future for another overbore if needed. Many sponsors here are doing 427's. Or you can go all the way to a 4.155 bore / 4.00 stoke and have a 434.
but I'd go with a 4.125 bore / 4.000 stroke kit. That's the most common. I have always tought that having a 427 sounds so much cool! This way, it would left you with plenty of room in the future for another overbore if needed. Many sponsors here are doing 427's. Or you can go all the way to a 4.155 bore / 4.00 stoke and have a 434.Maybe someone else can chime in and help us out? It would help a lot to know this. The guy at the shop where I'm having it done suggested boring .030 over because I have a small scratch in the wall of cylinder #8. If he did bore it .030 over and resleeve, then what kind of stroker kit would I need? I'm new to this stroker stuff, so anything helps.
Last edited by ArcticZ28; Apr 5, 2005 at 06:11 PM.
Launching!
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 273
Likes: 1
From: Trois-Rivières (Québec / Canada)
Originally Posted by ArcticZ28
Maybe someone else can chime in and help us out? It would help a lot to know this. The guy at the shop where I'm having it done suggested boring .030 over because I have a small scratch in the wall of cylinder #8. If he did bore it .030 over and resleeve, then what kind of stroker kit would I need? I'm new to this stroker stuff, so anything helps.
I checked out on the MTI site:
http://www.motorsporttech.com/fbody_engine02.asp
The unfinished bore of their sleeve is 4.117". A .030 over would put them at 4.147" (432cid ???
). The way it works is that you have to replaced your sleeves and bore them to the desired diameter (in my earlier example, 4.125" for a 427cid).Usually, a commonly called ".030 over" will be performed on a 6.0L iron block (4.000 x 3.622) and combined with a 4.000 stroker kit to get a 408 (4.030 x 4.000). Have you tought about that route? Some guys here are putting out pretty solid numbers from those 408 iron blocks. And they cost far less than a resleeved and stoked aluminum LS1 (mass production block and less machining). And don't forget that with a resleeved engine, you have always the risk of dropping a sleeve (many guys were having this problem a couple years ago and thats what drove me to the stroker route).
If you're really tight on your budget, there is also the SLP ZL402 iron block stroker (6.0L with Eagle 4" crank) that they sell for $3500 plus shipping or so. That way, you can put the extra cash to do your heads, cam, etc...
Only drawbacks of iron blocks are more weight in the front (~100lbs) and less efficient heat dissipation than an all aluminum engine. But you also got an almost undestructible engine.
Good Luck with your choice!
Arp head studs 12pt $252.00
Arp main studs kit $168.00
Arp assmbly lube $8.00
Arp balancer bolt $27.00
Head gaskets, front and rear cover gaskets. front and rear main gaskets
Oil pain gasket valley cover gasket $300
These are just some of the things i can remember right now on putting the motor back together. price are aprrox. not exact but close off thunders website.
I would use all ARP bolt on putting the motor back together.
Arp main studs kit $168.00
Arp assmbly lube $8.00
Arp balancer bolt $27.00
Head gaskets, front and rear cover gaskets. front and rear main gaskets
Oil pain gasket valley cover gasket $300
These are just some of the things i can remember right now on putting the motor back together. price are aprrox. not exact but close off thunders website.
I would use all ARP bolt on putting the motor back together.
Unless you're serious about big power, why spend so much money putting in the big sleeves? You cannot bore the stock sleeve .030 over, so just repair your block by having the single damaged cylinder sleeve replaced and hone them all to 3.905 (stock=3.898). Get your stroker kit (most consist of a 4" stroke crank, 6.125" rods, and proper pistons for stroke and rod combo) and you're at 383. Or you can buy a resleeved "big bore" block from one of the sponsors for $2600+ and the rest of the corresponding "stroker kit" will be very similar in cost to the 383 kit ($2300+, depending on components, ie, Eagle vs Lunati vs ??), but basically just a larger set pistons/rings.
Sound right?
Sound right?
