Nick.H @ the track
No way I could launch that low without slipping the living **** out of the clutch. When I launch around 6k I spin a little bit for about 10-15ft then hook. At 3800 I wouldn't spin at all. That's how I used to launch (slipping the ***** off the clutch) and I could 60' in the low 1.6's, but my clutch only lasted about 10k miles. I may consider going to a lighter setup for my next clutch since I'll be going to 4.56's and the car will be quite a bit lighter.
Good numbers using a relatively mild cam, LS6 heads seem to never dissapoint. Do you know what ET/MPH? Raceweight?
Not all large camshafts drive like **** on the street. That's an internet myth that was put out there usually by people that have no personal experience running larger camshafts. The Tick Stage 3 has been said by several to offer exceptional driveability on the street with virtually no surging as long as you use the proper gearing (proper stall/gear in an auto). Operating range for that camshaft is 2000-6700rpm. As for sacrificing some low end, that's a given with a large camshaft, but not to the point to where the car is a pain to drive on the street. As long as the tuning is right, and you have the right stall, gears etc.you'll be fine. The problem with the "smaller" camshafts is, yeah they make great power down low, but they suck *** up top, and ultimately just don't make the power something like the Tick Stage 3 will. I ran a Vindicator II from Vengeance which is, IIRC 240/244 .6xx and the car was a joy to drive on the street, and offered so much more power than my old TR224. Wasn't even comparable, quite laughable actually when my tuner first showed me an graph overlay with my old cam vs current one. Yes, you have your cake and eat it too.
Now something like a T-Rex on stock/untouched heads 346 might fall under the catagory of "not street friendly".
The comment highlighted in bold couldn't be further. I hate for a novice to read something like that and actually buy into it.
Regardless, he won't be hurting any bolt-on Mustang GT owners feelings with that baby old-tech camshaft. I don't know if you've heard the news, but these Coyote's are hitting well north of 400whp with "bolt-ons". A local guy just made 456whp on pump on a dynojet in a '12 BOSS.
And anyone who would run a Tick Stage 3 with stock gears obviously has no idea what they're doing. That type of non-sense is what has given big cams a bad name and make people skurred to run them. A "properly" setup S3 cam/heads/gears/stall/tune etc will **** all over a baby 224 cammed car. That argument is ridiculous IMO.
No disrespect, but the last comment in bold is utter non sense.
I wouldn't waste time with that cam period. You're talking about a cam that is almost a decade old for gosh sakes.
OP, I gave you solid advice, but at the end of the day, its what YOU want. Whatever you do though, ditch that old camshaft for a new one.
And people wonder why the FASTEST ls1 cars run larger camshafts.
And how would you know HiNegro? You've proven time after time you have zero knowledge of anything tech related.
Keep ridin' dem firebirds LikeAB0ss yo.
Not all large camshafts drive like **** on the street. That's an internet myth that was put out there usually by people that have no personal experience running larger camshafts. The Tick Stage 3 has been said by several to offer exceptional driveability on the street with virtually no surging as long as you use the proper gearing (proper stall/gear in an auto). Operating range for that camshaft is 2000-6700rpm. As for sacrificing some low end, that's a given with a large camshaft, but not to the point to where the car is a pain to drive on the street. As long as the tuning is right, and you have the right stall, gears etc.you'll be fine. The problem with the "smaller" camshafts is, yeah they make great power down low, but they suck *** up top, and ultimately just don't make the power something like the Tick Stage 3 will. I ran a Vindicator II from Vengeance which is, IIRC 240/244 .6xx and the car was a joy to drive on the street, and offered so much more power than my old TR224. Wasn't even comparable, quite laughable actually when my tuner first showed me an graph overlay with my old cam vs current one. Yes, you have your cake and eat it too.
Now something like a T-Rex on stock/untouched heads 346 might fall under the catagory of "not street friendly".
The comment highlighted in bold couldn't be further. I hate for a novice to read something like that and actually buy into it.
Regardless, he won't be hurting any bolt-on Mustang GT owners feelings with that baby old-tech camshaft. I don't know if you've heard the news, but these Coyote's are hitting well north of 400whp with "bolt-ons". A local guy just made 456whp on pump on a dynojet in a '12 BOSS.
And anyone who would run a Tick Stage 3 with stock gears obviously has no idea what they're doing. That type of non-sense is what has given big cams a bad name and make people skurred to run them. A "properly" setup S3 cam/heads/gears/stall/tune etc will **** all over a baby 224 cammed car. That argument is ridiculous IMO.
No disrespect, but the last comment in bold is utter non sense.
I wouldn't waste time with that cam period. You're talking about a cam that is almost a decade old for gosh sakes.
OP, I gave you solid advice, but at the end of the day, its what YOU want. Whatever you do though, ditch that old camshaft for a new one.
And people wonder why the FASTEST ls1 cars run larger camshafts.
And how would you know HiNegro? You've proven time after time you have zero knowledge of anything tech related.
Keep ridin' dem firebirds LikeAB0ss yo.
Nick, your "decade old tech" cam should be the least of your worries right now. Especially coming from a budget perspective. You have things that are holding your current cam back from performing how it should. Replace it with a new tech cam, and you're still going to have those issues holding back the new cam from performing like it should.
Nick if it makes you feel any better, my first time at the track I ran a 13.3 at 108. Might see if I can find that slip. This is the oldest slip I have posted on FB (street tires, this was before the 9" or any suspension really, I think I had just the cam and maybe my Monster clutch at this point, I wasn't serious about the track at all, was just chasing 112mph because somebody bet me I couldn't):
And this is my best/latest slip. Car is down maybe 100 pounds (still 3800, 50 from myself, and 50 from misc. savings but 9" probably negated most of that) and a different set of gears/9" + sticky tires and learning the car. You'll get used to it...it takes time. It's fun, really, who gives a **** what you run at the end of they day. Half the people in this section just sit on their computer and post **** about other people running while others of us go out and just have fun every chance we can.
Can it be discouraging? Sure. You know how long I've been chasing an 11 second run and how many slips I have that say 12? But it's fun. Is your car not optimal? Definitely. But it's a learning experience and this only taught you that you probably need to look to see how you can improve your cars performance.
FOUND IT: This is my first day drag racing ever. Actually first time I ever raced the car, or even drove it 'hard' that I can remember (on the street or what have you). On 19s, at probably 3900 pounds. Slips are in order of runs (Had one more, but missed a shift apparently, it was bad).
And this is my best/latest slip. Car is down maybe 100 pounds (still 3800, 50 from myself, and 50 from misc. savings but 9" probably negated most of that) and a different set of gears/9" + sticky tires and learning the car. You'll get used to it...it takes time. It's fun, really, who gives a **** what you run at the end of they day. Half the people in this section just sit on their computer and post **** about other people running while others of us go out and just have fun every chance we can.
Can it be discouraging? Sure. You know how long I've been chasing an 11 second run and how many slips I have that say 12? But it's fun. Is your car not optimal? Definitely. But it's a learning experience and this only taught you that you probably need to look to see how you can improve your cars performance.
FOUND IT: This is my first day drag racing ever. Actually first time I ever raced the car, or even drove it 'hard' that I can remember (on the street or what have you). On 19s, at probably 3900 pounds. Slips are in order of runs (Had one more, but missed a shift apparently, it was bad).
Last edited by Guitar; Mar 22, 2015 at 03:48 PM.
TECH Junkie
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,913
Likes: 366
From: White Bear, Mn
Nick if it makes you feel any better, my first time at the track I ran a 13.3 at 108. Might see if I can find that slip. This is the oldest slip I have posted on FB (street tires, this was before the 9" or any suspension really, I think I had just the cam and maybe my Monster clutch at this point, I wasn't serious about the track at all, was just chasing 112mph because somebody bet me I couldn't):
And this is my best/latest slip. Car is down maybe 100 pounds (still 3800, 50 from myself, and 50 from misc. savings but 9" probably negated most of that) and a different set of gears/9" + sticky tires and learning the car. You'll get used to it...it takes time. It's fun, really, who gives a **** what you run at the end of they day. Half the people in this section just sit on their computer and post **** about other people running while others of us go out and just have fun every chance we can.
And this is my best/latest slip. Car is down maybe 100 pounds (still 3800, 50 from myself, and 50 from misc. savings but 9" probably negated most of that) and a different set of gears/9" + sticky tires and learning the car. You'll get used to it...it takes time. It's fun, really, who gives a **** what you run at the end of they day. Half the people in this section just sit on their computer and post **** about other people running while others of us go out and just have fun every chance we can.
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 818
Likes: 2
From: heading South East on Bakalakadaka street
I'd go intake manifold, gears, solid tune and try again.
[edit]
I agree with what these guys above are saying. A lot of people just talk ****. Get in on the Crow challenge. Won't hurt you to. If anything, it'll give you a goal to reach for the season.
[edit]
I agree with what these guys above are saying. A lot of people just talk ****. Get in on the Crow challenge. Won't hurt you to. If anything, it'll give you a goal to reach for the season.
Good numbers using a relatively mild cam, LS6 heads seem to never dissapoint. Do you know what ET/MPH? Raceweight?
Not all large camshafts drive like **** on the street. That's an internet myth that was put out there usually by people that have no personal experience running larger camshafts. The Tick Stage 3 has been said by several to offer exceptional driveability on the street with virtually no surging as long as you use the proper gearing (proper stall/gear in an auto). Operating range for that camshaft is 2000-6700rpm. As for sacrificing some low end, that's a given with a large camshaft, but not to the point to where the car is a pain to drive on the street. As long as the tuning is right, and you have the right stall, gears etc.you'll be fine. The problem with the "smaller" camshafts is, yeah they make great power down low, but they suck *** up top, and ultimately just don't make the power something like the Tick Stage 3 will. I ran a Vindicator II from Vengeance which is, IIRC 240/244 .6xx and the car was a joy to drive on the street, and offered so much more power than my old TR224. Wasn't even comparable, quite laughable actually when my tuner first showed me an graph overlay with my old cam vs current one. Yes, you have your cake and eat it too.
Now something like a T-Rex on stock/untouched heads 346 might fall under the catagory of "not street friendly".
The comment highlighted in bold couldn't be further. I hate for a novice to read something like that and actually buy into it.
Regardless, he won't be hurting any bolt-on Mustang GT owners feelings with that baby old-tech camshaft. I don't know if you've heard the news, but these Coyote's are hitting well north of 400whp with "bolt-ons". A local guy just made 456whp on pump on a dynojet in a '12 BOSS.
And anyone who would run a Tick Stage 3 with stock gears obviously has no idea what they're doing. That type of non-sense is what has given big cams a bad name and make people skurred to run them. A "properly" setup S3 cam/heads/gears/stall/tune etc will **** all over a baby 224 cammed car. That argument is ridiculous IMO.
No disrespect, but the last comment in bold is utter non sense.
I wouldn't waste time with that cam period. You're talking about a cam that is almost a decade old for gosh sakes.
OP, I gave you solid advice, but at the end of the day, its what YOU want. Whatever you do though, ditch that old camshaft for a new one.
And people wonder why the FASTEST ls1 cars run larger camshafts.
And how would you know HiNegro? You've proven time after time you have zero knowledge of anything tech related.
Keep ridin' dem firebirds LikeAB0ss yo.
Not all large camshafts drive like **** on the street. That's an internet myth that was put out there usually by people that have no personal experience running larger camshafts. The Tick Stage 3 has been said by several to offer exceptional driveability on the street with virtually no surging as long as you use the proper gearing (proper stall/gear in an auto). Operating range for that camshaft is 2000-6700rpm. As for sacrificing some low end, that's a given with a large camshaft, but not to the point to where the car is a pain to drive on the street. As long as the tuning is right, and you have the right stall, gears etc.you'll be fine. The problem with the "smaller" camshafts is, yeah they make great power down low, but they suck *** up top, and ultimately just don't make the power something like the Tick Stage 3 will. I ran a Vindicator II from Vengeance which is, IIRC 240/244 .6xx and the car was a joy to drive on the street, and offered so much more power than my old TR224. Wasn't even comparable, quite laughable actually when my tuner first showed me an graph overlay with my old cam vs current one. Yes, you have your cake and eat it too.
Now something like a T-Rex on stock/untouched heads 346 might fall under the catagory of "not street friendly".
The comment highlighted in bold couldn't be further. I hate for a novice to read something like that and actually buy into it.
Regardless, he won't be hurting any bolt-on Mustang GT owners feelings with that baby old-tech camshaft. I don't know if you've heard the news, but these Coyote's are hitting well north of 400whp with "bolt-ons". A local guy just made 456whp on pump on a dynojet in a '12 BOSS.
And anyone who would run a Tick Stage 3 with stock gears obviously has no idea what they're doing. That type of non-sense is what has given big cams a bad name and make people skurred to run them. A "properly" setup S3 cam/heads/gears/stall/tune etc will **** all over a baby 224 cammed car. That argument is ridiculous IMO.
No disrespect, but the last comment in bold is utter non sense.
I wouldn't waste time with that cam period. You're talking about a cam that is almost a decade old for gosh sakes.
OP, I gave you solid advice, but at the end of the day, its what YOU want. Whatever you do though, ditch that old camshaft for a new one.
And people wonder why the FASTEST ls1 cars run larger camshafts.
And how would you know HiNegro? You've proven time after time you have zero knowledge of anything tech related.
Keep ridin' dem firebirds LikeAB0ss yo.
He'll hurt plenty 5.0 feelings once he gets his bolt ons sorted hell bolt on ls1's can do that when theyre done correctly. Are you forgetting most of the fastest ls1 records were set with those old tech cams? Sure cams today are better but the XER lobes the 224r is ground on are good power lobes. Modern lobes dont make much more if any power than xer ones do, what makes them awesome is they dont beat the hell out of your valvetrain doing it.
Also I NEVER said cars with big cams dont run good thats just stupid, what I DID say is that his car with all the right bolt ons would **** over his setup now if he just dropped an SNS stg 3 in and thats true. Of course a BIG cam would be faster everywhere if you had everything to compliment it. But thats not what you said at first and thats not what the op is doing so who cares? If he went to an SNS stage 3 and really wanted to make it count he would need a set of CNC heads with some compression behind them a stout valvetrain among other things all which cost big $$$. None of those which you mentioned in your original "get that dino cam out of there" comment.
Nick bottom line is dont listen to this guy lol sticking a bigger cam in your car will not solve any issues. Look at guys like NNSANE and some people in the drag section, none of them run big cams for their times. What they do have are well thought out setups with ALL the boltons which make the difference in the end.
Now with that said I need to get my *** to the track this week, they've been redoing it over the winter from what I heard but it didnt matter because I just got my suspension buttoned up.
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Nick, your "decade old tech" cam should be the least of your worries right now. Especially coming from a budget perspective. You have things that are holding your current cam back from performing how it should. Replace it with a new tech cam, and you're still going to have those issues holding back the new cam from performing like it should.
Every large cam sacrifices SOMETHING otherwise we would all run them. That's great the Vindicator II ran well for you and drove ok for what you thought. However everyone's definition of streetability is different and unless you have a **** tune theres no way a 240/244 cam will drive like a 224. Its not lobes or some magic fairy dust, its just physics. I can hop in my car with 3-4 degrees overlap then go to my buddies lq9 with cnc heads and 10 degrees overlap and then drive in my other buddies SNS stg 3 and with each one you can feel the loss in driveability. Btw all the lq9 has katech cnc stage 2 243's and a 230/238 112 eps cam. But he has stock gears, small headers/y pipe, ls6 intake etc and I bitch slap that car all the down the block when we race with my "tiny" cam lol and he can drive, difference are the supporting mods.
He'll hurt plenty 5.0 feelings once he gets his bolt ons sorted hell bolt on ls1's can do that when theyre done correctly. Are you forgetting most of the fastest ls1 records were set with those old tech cams? Sure cams today are better but the XER lobes the 224r is ground on are good power lobes. Modern lobes dont make much more if any power than xer ones do, what makes them awesome is they dont beat the hell out of your valvetrain doing it.
Also I NEVER said cars with big cams dont run good thats just stupid, what I DID say is that his car with all the right bolt ons would **** over his setup now if he just dropped an SNS stg 3 in and thats true. Of course a BIG cam would be faster everywhere if you had everything to compliment it. But thats not what you said at first and thats not what the op is doing so who cares? If he went to an SNS stage 3 and really wanted to make it count he would need a set of CNC heads with some compression behind them a stout valvetrain among other things all which cost big $$$. None of those which you mentioned in your original "get that dino cam out of there" comment.
Nick bottom line is dont listen to this guy lol sticking a bigger cam in your car will not solve any issues. Look at guys like NNSANE and some people in the drag section, none of them run big cams for their times. What they do have are well thought out setups with ALL the boltons which make the difference in the end.
Now with that said I need to get my *** to the track this week, they've been redoing it over the winter from what I heard but it didnt matter because I just got my suspension buttoned up.
He'll hurt plenty 5.0 feelings once he gets his bolt ons sorted hell bolt on ls1's can do that when theyre done correctly. Are you forgetting most of the fastest ls1 records were set with those old tech cams? Sure cams today are better but the XER lobes the 224r is ground on are good power lobes. Modern lobes dont make much more if any power than xer ones do, what makes them awesome is they dont beat the hell out of your valvetrain doing it.
Also I NEVER said cars with big cams dont run good thats just stupid, what I DID say is that his car with all the right bolt ons would **** over his setup now if he just dropped an SNS stg 3 in and thats true. Of course a BIG cam would be faster everywhere if you had everything to compliment it. But thats not what you said at first and thats not what the op is doing so who cares? If he went to an SNS stage 3 and really wanted to make it count he would need a set of CNC heads with some compression behind them a stout valvetrain among other things all which cost big $$$. None of those which you mentioned in your original "get that dino cam out of there" comment.
Nick bottom line is dont listen to this guy lol sticking a bigger cam in your car will not solve any issues. Look at guys like NNSANE and some people in the drag section, none of them run big cams for their times. What they do have are well thought out setups with ALL the boltons which make the difference in the end.
Now with that said I need to get my *** to the track this week, they've been redoing it over the winter from what I heard but it didnt matter because I just got my suspension buttoned up.
The bottomline is, the OP wants to know what takes to beat a bolt-on 5.0. A 224 cam car with bolt-ons ain't gonna cut it. Period. Not a well driven 5.0 with mods his buddy has...hell no. Especially not on a 1/4 mile track. We didn't even get to see the carnage that was about to happen since this was only an eigth mile track. Its going to take the LS1 Mo Powa!
Again, I ran the 224 cam years ago...nothing special. ~385whp torque monster, good low to midrange. Leaves a bit to be desired up top. Welcome to yesteryear.
Ignore the troll Nick. He is a wack job
I would suggest gears,better intake,bigger headers and then a retune. I was killing bros like that in the video with small cam,junk headers,stock gears and mistakes do a search on act forums. Your cam is not the problem. Keep it and improve what you have. You will have the ability to beat bolt on bros. Work on weight and traction as well.
I would suggest gears,better intake,bigger headers and then a retune. I was killing bros like that in the video with small cam,junk headers,stock gears and mistakes do a search on act forums. Your cam is not the problem. Keep it and improve what you have. You will have the ability to beat bolt on bros. Work on weight and traction as well.
The last bolt-on car i helped with was 1 sec and almost 10 mph faster in the 1/8 than nick. That made it quite a bit quicker than that 5br0 to.
1st thing nick needs is a clutch. Power won't help if he can't change gears.
1st thing nick needs is a clutch. Power won't help if he can't change gears.
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Some of you LS1 guys remind me so much of the Mustang guys from about 15-20 years. Boy does it hurt when the shoe is on the other foot. Dem five.oh's be striking fear in the hearts of the LS-loyalists.
J/K.
On a serious note, when you look at the stock cube H/C Fastest List, in the 10 second bracket, out of the TOP 20 cars that lists specs, they all ran medium to large size camshafts.
1) G5X2 232/240
2) Not listed
3) Not listed
4) Cartek Stage 3 234/234
5) Not listed
6) T-Rex 242/248
7) 239/240
8) MS3 237/232
9) Cartek 4X 242/242
10) 240/244
11) Not listed
12) 235/242
13) Not listed
14) MS3 237/232
15) 230/227
16) Not listed
17) Not listed
18) Cartex 4X 242/242
19) S17 238/244
20) Not listed
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...ck-ci-h-c.html
MORE POWA, with the right supporting parts, equals faster ET's. Period.
J/K.
On a serious note, when you look at the stock cube H/C Fastest List, in the 10 second bracket, out of the TOP 20 cars that lists specs, they all ran medium to large size camshafts.
1) G5X2 232/240
2) Not listed
3) Not listed
4) Cartek Stage 3 234/234
5) Not listed
6) T-Rex 242/248
7) 239/240
8) MS3 237/232
9) Cartek 4X 242/242
10) 240/244
11) Not listed
12) 235/242
13) Not listed
14) MS3 237/232
15) 230/227
16) Not listed
17) Not listed
18) Cartex 4X 242/242
19) S17 238/244
20) Not listed
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...ck-ci-h-c.html
MORE POWA, with the right supporting parts, equals faster ET's. Period.
Last edited by Holeshot 346; Mar 22, 2015 at 08:39 PM.
Some of you LS1 guys remind me so much of the Mustang guys from about 15-20 years. Boy does it hurt when the shoe is on the other foot. Dem five.oh's be striking fear in the hearts of the LS-loyalists.
J/K.
On a serious note, when you look at the stock cube H/C Fastest List, in the 10 second bracket, the TOP 20 cars all ran medium to large size camshafts.
1) G5X2 232/240
2) Not listed
3) Not listed
4) Cartek Stage 3 234/234
5) Not listed
6) T-Rex 242/248
7) 239/240
8) MS3 237/232
9) Cartek 4X 242/242
10) 240/244
11) Not listed
12) 235/242
13) Not listed
14) MS3 237/232
15) 230/227
16) Not listed
17) Not listed
18) Cartex 4X 242/242
19) S17 238/244
20) Not listed
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...ck-ci-h-c.html
MORE POWA, with the right supporting parts, equals faster ET's. Period.
J/K.
On a serious note, when you look at the stock cube H/C Fastest List, in the 10 second bracket, the TOP 20 cars all ran medium to large size camshafts.
1) G5X2 232/240
2) Not listed
3) Not listed
4) Cartek Stage 3 234/234
5) Not listed
6) T-Rex 242/248
7) 239/240
8) MS3 237/232
9) Cartek 4X 242/242
10) 240/244
11) Not listed
12) 235/242
13) Not listed
14) MS3 237/232
15) 230/227
16) Not listed
17) Not listed
18) Cartex 4X 242/242
19) S17 238/244
20) Not listed
https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...ck-ci-h-c.html
MORE POWA, with the right supporting parts, equals faster ET's. Period.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Heck, using the advice of redbird555, I bet I could make the #1 spot on that list with a 220 grind. Blow eeerybody out the water.
I'll say it again. More power + plus the right supporting parts = Faster ET/MPH about 99.999% of the time. There's no arguing that.
I'll say it again. More power + plus the right supporting parts = Faster ET/MPH about 99.999% of the time. There's no arguing that.
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
And for the record, I ran the Vindicator II when it was new in 2007. If I were to build another LS1 car today it wouldn't have a Vindicator, but something along the lines of the Stage 3 from Martin or the 236/242 from Cam Motion seems like a good choice.