Literally JUST got done installing Watts Link
12-05-2008, 05:20 AM
#1
Literally JUST got done installing Watts Link Wow, there is a really big difference in the way the car starts and ends turns. It feels almost like it starts the turn before you start turning the wheel. For the most part, the install wasn't even really that hard. I still need to dial it in to my car and fine tune the thing, but i HIGHLY reccomend it, for what it's worth.
12-05-2008, 10:33 AM
#3
Amazing isn't it? Almost hard to put into words how different the car feels. Goes to show how limiting the good 'ol Panhard bar setup really is.
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12-05-2008, 11:13 AM
#4
Does a W/L 'kit' exist? OK, I'll admit it - I didn't know what a "Watt's Link" was, but I found out with a couple of clicks...
Sounds like the best solution to keep the rear centered so the largest tires can be used w/o fear of rubbing at any time - cool!
So, this beggs the question, is there an F-Body Watt's Link kit? Or did you fab it up yourself?
LMK!
Sounds like the best solution to keep the rear centered so the largest tires can be used w/o fear of rubbing at any time - cool!
So, this beggs the question, is there an F-Body Watt's Link kit? Or did you fab it up yourself?
LMK!
Wow, there is a really big difference in the way the car starts and ends turns. It feels almost like it starts the turn before you start turning the wheel. For the most part, the install wasn't even really that hard. I still need to dial it in to my car and fine tune the thing, but i HIGHLY reccomend it, for what it's worth.
12-05-2008, 11:14 AM
#5
The cornering is where you feel it the most. It feels similar to a really fast army tank in the way that it turns. The grip in the back makes it feel really planted on the ground. It still needs to be adjusted, so I can't quite speak for the full effect of the handling, but just testing it out and troubleshooting, you can tell the difference.
12-05-2008, 11:17 AM
#6
OK, I'll admit it - I didn't know what a "Watt's Link" was, but I found out with a couple of clicks...
Sounds like the best solution to keep the rear centered so the largest tires can be used w/o fear of rubbing at any time - cool!
So, this beggs the question, is there an F-Body Watt's Link kit? Or did you fab it up yourself?
LMK!
Sounds like the best solution to keep the rear centered so the largest tires can be used w/o fear of rubbing at any time - cool!
So, this beggs the question, is there an F-Body Watt's Link kit? Or did you fab it up yourself?
LMK!
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
12-05-2008, 11:25 AM
#7
I just saw it on your site actually...
: )
So, given the fact that I just drive the car on the street and in the 1/4 mile, should I bother with something that costs 5 times as much as my brand new double adjustable Panrod bar? In other words, is the W/L for road racing only, while for street cars the cost isn't justified - or do the benefits (for ALL cars) outweigh the added costs - LMK!
: )
So, given the fact that I just drive the car on the street and in the 1/4 mile, should I bother with something that costs 5 times as much as my brand new double adjustable Panrod bar? In other words, is the W/L for road racing only, while for street cars the cost isn't justified - or do the benefits (for ALL cars) outweigh the added costs - LMK!
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12-05-2008, 11:32 AM
#8
I just saw it on your site actually...
: )
So, given the fact that I just drive the car on the street and in the 1/4 mile, should I bother with something that costs 5 times as much as my brand new double adjustable Panrod bar? In other words, is the W/L for road racing only, while for street cars the cost isn't justified - or do the benefits (for ALL cars) outweigh the added costs - LMK!
: )
So, given the fact that I just drive the car on the street and in the 1/4 mile, should I bother with something that costs 5 times as much as my brand new double adjustable Panrod bar? In other words, is the W/L for road racing only, while for street cars the cost isn't justified - or do the benefits (for ALL cars) outweigh the added costs - LMK!
12-05-2008, 11:59 AM
#9
Well, UnZfeat'd probably said it as pointedly as I could... 
You don't need to take my word for it, he's a street only driver and clearly he feels the difference is huge. And if you look around there are other posts that indicate similiar feelings.
Is a Watts Cheap? No. But not much worth having is. Clearly a Watts link uses more parts, and isn't something that can be easily copied like a PHB, which is about a simple a part as one can imagine. And because of that design there are limitations. PHB's are used for cost only purposes, not because they work better.
And for those that don't know, a Watts link is not a new thing. It's only new for the f-body. In fact it's called a Watts link because the guy who invented it was James Watt (you know the inventor of the Steam Engine). He first came up wiht idea in 1784. Funny how it only took us some 225 years to apply it to an F-body. They've been around and in use for quite a while on other cars, largely when stability which can also effect ride is an issue. A big reason why both cars like Ford Crown Victoria's and Chrysler PT Cruisers use them, but also why real race cars those run in the Australian V8 Supercar series also use them.
You don't need to take my word for it, he's a street only driver and clearly he feels the difference is huge. And if you look around there are other posts that indicate similiar feelings.Is a Watts Cheap? No. But not much worth having is. Clearly a Watts link uses more parts, and isn't something that can be easily copied like a PHB, which is about a simple a part as one can imagine. And because of that design there are limitations. PHB's are used for cost only purposes, not because they work better.
And for those that don't know, a Watts link is not a new thing. It's only new for the f-body. In fact it's called a Watts link because the guy who invented it was James Watt (you know the inventor of the Steam Engine). He first came up wiht idea in 1784. Funny how it only took us some 225 years to apply it to an F-body. They've been around and in use for quite a while on other cars, largely when stability which can also effect ride is an issue. A big reason why both cars like Ford Crown Victoria's and Chrysler PT Cruisers use them, but also why real race cars those run in the Australian V8 Supercar series also use them.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
12-05-2008, 01:19 PM
#10
A little more info, please! : ) S/S & UnZfeat'd -
I really appreciate all the information.
I did not know that UnZfeat'd's vehicle was (like mine) a street car; given the expense ($650) I thought / wrongly assumed that his car had to be a track car or a track and street car, not a daily driver.
Currently, I have 2002 17X9.5 WS6 rims on my 96 Formula, with Goodyear G1 / GS 275 / 40 /17s on it but, because of my newly hyper-secured rear-end (due to $800 of UMI stuff added about a month ago!) - my tires no longer hook up as now ALL of the torque that my LT1/4 produces is transferred to the rear wheels!
(This, IMHO, is a 'good' problem to have!)
Anyway - I've been looking at picking up a set of two 17 X 11 ZR1 wheels so I can mount those 315 / 35 / 17 monsters and get an additional 80 mm ([315 - 275] x 2) of rubber on the road. I've also considered getting some Bullet Specialies 15 x 10's and putting some "Sticky Mickeys" back there too. Either way, those folks that have done such a thing make reference to using a BFH to 'contour' the inner wheelwells - a thing I'd like to avoid.
So, if I can 'get away' with using my current setup / PRB on the street and NOT worry about rubbing, then I'll go with that; however, if this W/L is the only sure way to keep the rear end centered at all times with some 315 mm tires on the back, I may just need to bite the bullet and spend more $$$.
A little long-winded, I know, but now you know my situation - Your thoughts?
LMK!!!
Thanks!
: )
I really appreciate all the information.
I did not know that UnZfeat'd's vehicle was (like mine) a street car; given the expense ($650) I thought / wrongly assumed that his car had to be a track car or a track and street car, not a daily driver.
Currently, I have 2002 17X9.5 WS6 rims on my 96 Formula, with Goodyear G1 / GS 275 / 40 /17s on it but, because of my newly hyper-secured rear-end (due to $800 of UMI stuff added about a month ago!) - my tires no longer hook up as now ALL of the torque that my LT1/4 produces is transferred to the rear wheels!
(This, IMHO, is a 'good' problem to have!)
Anyway - I've been looking at picking up a set of two 17 X 11 ZR1 wheels so I can mount those 315 / 35 / 17 monsters and get an additional 80 mm ([315 - 275] x 2) of rubber on the road. I've also considered getting some Bullet Specialies 15 x 10's and putting some "Sticky Mickeys" back there too. Either way, those folks that have done such a thing make reference to using a BFH to 'contour' the inner wheelwells - a thing I'd like to avoid.
So, if I can 'get away' with using my current setup / PRB on the street and NOT worry about rubbing, then I'll go with that; however, if this W/L is the only sure way to keep the rear end centered at all times with some 315 mm tires on the back, I may just need to bite the bullet and spend more $$$.
A little long-winded, I know, but now you know my situation - Your thoughts?
LMK!!!
Thanks!
: )
Originally Posted by UnZfeat'd
Well, when i bought mine, Sam put it to me like this... I was going to buy a double adjustable panhard rod and a panhard rod relocation kit, then same said that with the about 400 i would be spending on the panhard setup, i could be getting so much more out of my suspension setup with only around 250 more. Since you already have your panhard rod, if you are happy with it, then keep it. You got the adjustable panhard rod for better handling, i am assuming, so why not just make your daily driver that much better?
Well, UnZfeat'd probably said it as pointedly as I could... You don't need to take my word for it, he's a street only driver and clearly he feels the difference is huge. And if you look around there are other posts that indicate similiar feelings.
Is a Watts Cheap? No. But not much worth having is. Clearly a Watts link uses more parts, and isn't something that can be easily copied like a PHB, which is about a simple a part as one can imagine. And because of that design there are limitations. PHB's are used for cost only purposes, not because they work better.
And for those that don't know, a Watts link is not a new thing. It's only new for the f-body. In fact it's called a Watts link because the guy who invented it was James Watt (you know the inventor of the Steam Engine). He first came up wiht idea in 1784. Funny how it only took us some 225 years to apply it to an F-body. They've been around and in use for quite a while on other cars, largely when stability which can also effect ride is an issue. A big reason why both cars like Ford Crown Victoria's and Chrysler PT Cruisers use them, but also why real race cars those run in the Australian V8 Supercar series also use them.
You don't need to take my word for it, he's a street only driver and clearly he feels the difference is huge. And if you look around there are other posts that indicate similiar feelings.Is a Watts Cheap? No. But not much worth having is. Clearly a Watts link uses more parts, and isn't something that can be easily copied like a PHB, which is about a simple a part as one can imagine. And because of that design there are limitations. PHB's are used for cost only purposes, not because they work better.
And for those that don't know, a Watts link is not a new thing. It's only new for the f-body. In fact it's called a Watts link because the guy who invented it was James Watt (you know the inventor of the Steam Engine). He first came up wiht idea in 1784. Funny how it only took us some 225 years to apply it to an F-body. They've been around and in use for quite a while on other cars, largely when stability which can also effect ride is an issue. A big reason why both cars like Ford Crown Victoria's and Chrysler PT Cruisers use them, but also why real race cars those run in the Australian V8 Supercar series also use them.
12-05-2008, 02:31 PM
#11
A Watts link is an expensive part, personally, i got it because i was rear ended, got a lot of money for it, and beefed up the part that got hit. For you, if you are just wanting it to run bigger tires, i have heard of other ways that are more cost effective, but if you want that aspect and some extra handlign, then you might want to look into a Watts Link. If you want one but aren't quite sure about it yet, just wait a little while, this is still a new part and there is sure to be a lot of info coming in about it as people install them. I have a 99 so i had to grind off my brake clips from my rear end and modify my swaybar spacers, but i talked to Jim Fay and he said that he would take into account those modifications for future manufacturing... PS... sorry again about calling you at midnight your time, Jim!
12-06-2008, 12:33 AM
#15
The WATTS LINK is the best lateral locator for the Fbody that money can buy as a KIT. Sam Strano is going to be the guy to hook you up if you are into it.
The only thing that is better than a Watts Link isn't made for the Fbody and is WAY more complex than a Watts. It would have to be totally custom fabbed as no one would ever make it as a kit.
It is called a Mumford Link.
After installed my Watts Link (thanks SAM!!) I did a lot of research into racing cars. I can only hope to build my own tube frame car which I will do my solid works models on it.
http://www.not2fast.com/chassis/mumford.shtml
The main disadvantage to the Mike Mumford link is that it is more complex, requires two mounting points, and you can't visually see where the RC is without some measurement. With the Watts link you can visually and directly see the RC as the RC is the bolt itself.
The only thing that is better than a Watts Link isn't made for the Fbody and is WAY more complex than a Watts. It would have to be totally custom fabbed as no one would ever make it as a kit.
It is called a Mumford Link.
After installed my Watts Link (thanks SAM!!) I did a lot of research into racing cars. I can only hope to build my own tube frame car which I will do my solid works models on it.
http://www.not2fast.com/chassis/mumford.shtml
The main disadvantage to the Mike Mumford link is that it is more complex, requires two mounting points, and you can't visually see where the RC is without some measurement. With the Watts link you can visually and directly see the RC as the RC is the bolt itself.
Last edited by 2002_Z28_Six_Speed; 12-06-2008 at 12:40 AM.
12-08-2008, 01:58 PM
#16
Will not work on the fabricated rears, only "Traditional" axle housings.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
18 SCCA National Championships in house, many more for our customers prove we know our stuff.Talk is cheap, results matter.
Check out our KONI prices, our Master Cylinder Brace, and new Xtracker Hub/wheel bearing upgrade kits!
12-13-2008, 10:30 AM
#17
ugh. More money to spend, I just read another link about this on a certain 3rd gen forum 
which made my head hurt.
Anyone else tried this, and had an adjustable PHB before? Forgive me for asking, I don't doubt Sam or the OP but from what I've read the adj. PHB is a tried and true product on the F-Body but this is a completely new product for the F-Body. You could say I'm not one of those who will jump into the pool unless someone else confirms that it's not freezing. Another thing I'm worried about is noise, I noticed this Watts link has rod-ended connectors. My car is my DD and the drone on the highway from my Flowmaster 80 alone makes me go crazy.
I've been saving up for my suspension setup, now there's a possibility that I'll have to invest another $500, if I want the best?
It'd be nice to look forward to what the OP reported though, and to not have bump-steer. and not like it'll make or break the package otherwise, but is it available in black? If I had a white, black or red car I wouldn't mind red at all. But pewter and red.... ehh.
If anything, I honestly think I'll go adj. PHB then once more and more people confirm the product's worth, then I'll upgrade to that...
which made my head hurt.Anyone else tried this, and had an adjustable PHB before? Forgive me for asking, I don't doubt Sam or the OP but from what I've read the adj. PHB is a tried and true product on the F-Body but this is a completely new product for the F-Body. You could say I'm not one of those who will jump into the pool unless someone else confirms that it's not freezing. Another thing I'm worried about is noise, I noticed this Watts link has rod-ended connectors. My car is my DD and the drone on the highway from my Flowmaster 80 alone makes me go crazy.
I've been saving up for my suspension setup, now there's a possibility that I'll have to invest another $500, if I want the best?
It'd be nice to look forward to what the OP reported though, and to not have bump-steer. and not like it'll make or break the package otherwise, but is it available in black? If I had a white, black or red car I wouldn't mind red at all. But pewter and red.... ehh.If anything, I honestly think I'll go adj. PHB then once more and more people confirm the product's worth, then I'll upgrade to that...
12-13-2008, 04:29 PM
#18
only real thing keeping me from doing this is knowing that at some point i'm going to break my 10bolt and that when it happens, i'll upgrade the rear.
is there any stronger rear that will work with this product?
is there any stronger rear that will work with this product?
12-14-2008, 12:02 AM
#19
As far as I know this will work with a 9 inch with 3 inch axle tubes.
The fabricated rear end is the only one it won't work with.
ugh. More money to spend, I just read another link about this on a certain 3rd gen forum which made my head hurt.
Anyone else tried this, and had an adjustable PHB before? Forgive me for asking,.............
Another thing I'm worried about is noise, I noticed this Watts link has rod-ended connectors. My car is my DD and the drone on the highway from my Flowmaster 80 alone makes me go crazy.
...........
If anything, I honestly think I'll go adj. PHB then once more and more people confirm the product's worth, then I'll upgrade to that...
which made my head hurt.Anyone else tried this, and had an adjustable PHB before? Forgive me for asking,.............
Another thing I'm worried about is noise, I noticed this Watts link has rod-ended connectors. My car is my DD and the drone on the highway from my Flowmaster 80 alone makes me go crazy.
...........
If anything, I honestly think I'll go adj. PHB then once more and more people confirm the product's worth, then I'll upgrade to that...
I felt little diff from regular to adj
from adj to watts was day and night.
no additional noise from watts link. none at all.
the watts link doesn't even get near my hooker catb exhuast. plenty of room. not sure about the people who have duals over the axle though.
