I need lower control arms, bushing or roto??
#1
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Looking to lower my car and apply the LCA relocation brackets
as well. What are some companies? What kind of pricing?
Should I get standard polyurethane bushings or roto-joints?
Would prefer them to be serviceable with a grease fitting as
well. While on the topic, who makes a good set of lowering
springs. Thank you all. Hoorah.
Vehicle info - 2002 Camaro Z28, 4L60E, 10 Bolt.
as well. What are some companies? What kind of pricing?
Should I get standard polyurethane bushings or roto-joints?
Would prefer them to be serviceable with a grease fitting as
well. While on the topic, who makes a good set of lowering
springs. Thank you all. Hoorah.
Vehicle info - 2002 Camaro Z28, 4L60E, 10 Bolt.
#2
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Definitely not solid poly for the control arms, personally I would go with the Founders 3-piece poly http://www.foundersperformance.com/1...ce-poly-joint/ and there relo brackets http://www.foundersperformance.com/p...-Brackets.html also if you do intend on lowering you will need an adjustable panhard bar so get this one (no need for higher priced pieces) http://www.foundersperformance.com/p...-Bushings.html
if your doing lowering springs the best 2 are BMR and Strano and then you need good shocks to match (don't do springs on stock shocks) so if you hurry, shocks and springs can be gotten fairly cheap, but get them on the phone by tomorrow afternoon (the prices on BMR's site look like the non-sale prices and Strano needs to process the order before 5 PM eastern Friday).
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...-ok-3-1-a.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...ear-again.html
if your doing lowering springs the best 2 are BMR and Strano and then you need good shocks to match (don't do springs on stock shocks) so if you hurry, shocks and springs can be gotten fairly cheap, but get them on the phone by tomorrow afternoon (the prices on BMR's site look like the non-sale prices and Strano needs to process the order before 5 PM eastern Friday).
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...-ok-3-1-a.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...ear-again.html
#4
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Looking to lower my car and apply the LCA relocation brackets
as well. What are some companies? What kind of pricing?
Should I get standard polyurethane bushings or roto-joints?
Would prefer them to be serviceable with a grease fitting as
well. While on the topic, who makes a good set of lowering
springs. Thank you all. Hoorah.
Vehicle info - 2002 Camaro Z28, 4L60E, 10 Bolt.
as well. What are some companies? What kind of pricing?
Should I get standard polyurethane bushings or roto-joints?
Would prefer them to be serviceable with a grease fitting as
well. While on the topic, who makes a good set of lowering
springs. Thank you all. Hoorah.
Vehicle info - 2002 Camaro Z28, 4L60E, 10 Bolt.
MWC offers package discounts for you to make some great savings over what you could normally spend. Give us a call!
#5
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If the car is daily driven and just a street and straight line performance oriented, then there is nothing wrong with using regular polyurethane bushings. There is a lot of talk going around now about "bushing bind". Unless you are hardcore road racing or autocrossing the car, this isn't really a concern. As for roto joints or rod ends, you will definitely compromise ride quality and smoothness, but will have a bind free and indestructable suspension combination
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I'm 100% happy with the poly bushings on my UMI control arms. I'm also running UMI lower control arm brackets and... well... almost everything else they have for the f-body
The other sponsors also have great stuff, too (just trying to be an impartial "mod"
)
With that said, I do have rod ends on the axle side because I wanted adjustable. Just be wary of all the anti-poly "bind" hype.
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With that said, I do have rod ends on the axle side because I wanted adjustable. Just be wary of all the anti-poly "bind" hype.
#7
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If you're going to be subject to any competition rules, read those first. If you're not going to compete, I'd say stick with the OEM LCA's and use the 1LE-style Moog K6178 bushings.
For a lowered vehicle, I'm partial to PHB's with the adjustment on the ends. I'm not even close to being an ME, but I've read that under axial compression the forces applied to the bar are always concentrated near the middle of the bar with the least force at the ends.
For a lowered vehicle, I'm partial to PHB's with the adjustment on the ends. I'm not even close to being an ME, but I've read that under axial compression the forces applied to the bar are always concentrated near the middle of the bar with the least force at the ends.
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#8
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I'm 100% happy with the poly bushings on my UMI control arms. I'm also running UMI lower control arm brackets and... well... almost everything else they have for the f-body
The other sponsors also have great stuff, too (just trying to be an impartial "mod"
)
With that said, I do have rod ends on the axle side because I wanted adjustable. Just be wary of all the anti-poly "bind" hype.
![Happy](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_stretch.gif)
![Icon Lol](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies2/icon_lol.gif)
With that said, I do have rod ends on the axle side because I wanted adjustable. Just be wary of all the anti-poly "bind" hype.
#9
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I'm 100% happy with the poly bushings on my UMI control arms. I'm also running UMI lower control arm brackets and... well... almost everything else they have for the f-body
The other sponsors also have great stuff, too (just trying to be an impartial "mod"
)
With that said, I do have rod ends on the axle side because I wanted adjustable. Just be wary of all the anti-poly "bind" hype.
![Happy](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_stretch.gif)
![Icon Lol](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies2/icon_lol.gif)
With that said, I do have rod ends on the axle side because I wanted adjustable. Just be wary of all the anti-poly "bind" hype.
As was mentioned, for a straight line car it would be fine, but even from a ride comfort perspective the bind would be noticeable in comparison according to several posts I've read.
#10
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I pressed in some 1LE style bushings in my stock LCAs and it began to feel safe again.
I just don't see it as "hype."
#11
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Don't try to autocross a car that isn't set up for that type of driving, period. That should be common sense.
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I am not an engineer or professional driver -- neither are most of the people who continually profess how dangerous poly bushing bind is. I purely buy parts for my car that I believe work. I also provide advice based on my empirical and anecdotal experience. Nothing more -- nothing less.
One should purchase whatever they will gain the most utility from. If that is roto joints because they've bought into the fear from the "experts," then hey, more power to you. If one takes a step back to look at everything in the macro (i.e. the type of driving one actually does), then perhaps they'll understand the logic from those of us who aren't jumping on the anti-poly bandwagon.
Last edited by demonspeed; 05-30-2014 at 11:45 AM.
#13
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I wanted adjustable -- I couldn't have cared less if it was a rod end or poly bushing. If I didn't want adjustable then I would have just gone with poly ends on both sides. That's the context of the discussion. Period. edit: I did have non-adjustable UMI poly/poly rear control arms on my '00 SS. No, I did not drive in fear... and I even autocrossed it at the same event Sam Strano was at (Mid State Airport in Philipsburg). Of course, that was back in 2004 before all this poly drama manifested and spread like a disease.
http://umiperformance.com/catalog/in...roducts_id=109
#14
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IMO, there's nothing wrong with using (regular) poly bushings as long as it doesn't inhibit suspension articulation. In the rear LCAs of a 82-02 Camaro/firebird it does; fact not fiction. Furthermore, with the 82-92 Camaro/firebird rear suspension being almost identical and the rear LCAs and PHB interchangeable, the facts about the negative aspects of poly bushing have be around long before 2004.
Last edited by 99Bluz28; 05-31-2014 at 06:40 PM.
#15
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cgormanZ28 , thought you'd like a good option that not what most normally recommend, since they cost more than most LCA s do. Global West makes rear LCAs that have a rubber/spherical bearing combo. It'll offer good articulation and will be quiet (TBC-14, $225)
The spherical bearing GW uses last a long time before ever making any noise. I had a set of GW rear LCAs with spherical bearings on both ends and they were quiet for a good 7yrs.
pm sent.
The spherical bearing GW uses last a long time before ever making any noise. I had a set of GW rear LCAs with spherical bearings on both ends and they were quiet for a good 7yrs.
pm sent.
Last edited by 99Bluz28; 05-30-2014 at 07:11 PM.
#16
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If you're going to be subject to any competition rules, read those first. If you're not going to compete, I'd say stick with the OEM LCA's and use the 1LE-style Moog K6178 bushings.
For a lowered vehicle, I'm partial to PHB's with the adjustment on the ends. I'm not even close to being an ME, but I've read that under axial compression the forces applied to the bar are always concentrated near the middle of the bar with the least force at the ends.
For a lowered vehicle, I'm partial to PHB's with the adjustment on the ends. I'm not even close to being an ME, but I've read that under axial compression the forces applied to the bar are always concentrated near the middle of the bar with the least force at the ends.
#17
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This has absolutely nothing to do with auto-x. The bushings will bind in everyday driving situations while hitting a bump. In the case of the front lower control arm the bushing or the control arm will break in everyday driving situations. This has happened more than once, and all of which was with normal street driving.
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Poly motor mounts, trans mount, 3 piece poly joint LCA's, Poly TA Bushing, Poly PHB Bushings, the list goes on and on.
Never ONE single issue.
#18
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Do motor mounts, trans mounts, TA mounts articulate? No? Then there is no issue here, nothing binds because nothing moves.
The PHB has no real issues with poly bushings(1 axis of motion), and the founders "poly joint" bushings was their solution to the standard design that binds!
You may want to re-read my first post and notice I specifically say "in certain control arm locations" As in the caster bushing on the front control arm, and the bushings in the rear LCAs. These areas have more than one axis of rotation.
http://www.crystalridge.net/cars/bushings.htm
http://www.elephantracing.com/techtopic/binding.htm
https://ls1tech.com/forums/17820691-post27.html
#19
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You can buy adjustable LCAs with poly on both ends:
http://umiperformance.com/catalog/in...roducts_id=109
http://umiperformance.com/catalog/in...roducts_id=109
#20
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Great educational post!
newbies take note...
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Do motor mounts, trans mounts, TA mounts articulate? No? Then there is no issue here, nothing binds because nothing moves.
The PHB has no real issues with poly bushings(1 axis of motion), and the founders "poly joint" bushings was their solution to the standard design that binds!
You may want to re-read my first post and notice I specifically say "in certain control arm locations" As in the caster bushing on the front control arm, and the bushings in the rear LCAs. These areas have more than one axis of rotation.
http://www.crystalridge.net/cars/bushings.htm
http://www.elephantracing.com/techtopic/binding.htm
https://ls1tech.com/forums/17820691-post27.html
The PHB has no real issues with poly bushings(1 axis of motion), and the founders "poly joint" bushings was their solution to the standard design that binds!
You may want to re-read my first post and notice I specifically say "in certain control arm locations" As in the caster bushing on the front control arm, and the bushings in the rear LCAs. These areas have more than one axis of rotation.
http://www.crystalridge.net/cars/bushings.htm
http://www.elephantracing.com/techtopic/binding.htm
https://ls1tech.com/forums/17820691-post27.html