Maxing out a bolt-on only car (stock heads, stock cam, NA)
01-26-2011, 11:57 AM
#81
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A little race gas never hurt anything..... right? 
Magnet, You culd use a little less fuel on the top ed of your curve by far. There are a few ponies left there. For what it worth, I dyno'd to the wheels 342/351 with just a slp lid and a 14.4 afr, this was prior to minor tweaking of the tune. I ran that car that lean pretty hard for a very long time. When my motor was finally taken apart, the builder was very surprised how clean the motor was and how good it looked for having 180k beat on miles.
Magnet, You culd use a little less fuel on the top ed of your curve by far. There are a few ponies left there. For what it worth, I dyno'd to the wheels 342/351 with just a slp lid and a 14.4 afr, this was prior to minor tweaking of the tune. I ran that car that lean pretty hard for a very long time. When my motor was finally taken apart, the builder was very surprised how clean the motor was and how good it looked for having 180k beat on miles.
01-26-2011, 12:54 PM
#82
A little race gas never hurt anything..... right?
Magnet, You culd use a little less fuel on the top ed of your curve by far. There are a few ponies left there. For what it worth, I dyno'd to the wheels 342/351 with just a slp lid and a 14.4 afr, this was prior to minor tweaking of the tune. I ran that car that lean pretty hard for a very long time. When my motor was finally taken apart, the builder was very surprised how clean the motor was and how good it looked for having 180k beat on miles.
Magnet, You culd use a little less fuel on the top ed of your curve by far. There are a few ponies left there. For what it worth, I dyno'd to the wheels 342/351 with just a slp lid and a 14.4 afr, this was prior to minor tweaking of the tune. I ran that car that lean pretty hard for a very long time. When my motor was finally taken apart, the builder was very surprised how clean the motor was and how good it looked for having 180k beat on miles.
01-26-2011, 03:41 PM
#83
I'm not positive on the heads, I'll look at mine when I install it, but I'm not conscerned. The people I have talked to have all indacted that I shouldn't lose any power from the intake. From what I have gleaned, it isn't like a carb. That is to say you can't "over carb" the motor aka "over intake" it.
01-26-2011, 05:54 PM
#84
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Just some FYI since your contesting whether intakes really help SI. I made 352 rwhp on a non ported 78mm FAST and went 11.0 SI with it. As far as HP nums. maybe couldve got a few more HP out of it but wouldve lost a helluva lot of torque down low.
I tried cam2 as well, didnt seem to make much diff. besides burning up the O2's lol
I tried cam2 as well, didnt seem to make much diff. besides burning up the O2's lol
01-26-2011, 06:40 PM
#85
Just some FYI since your contesting whether intakes really help SI. I made 352 rwhp on a non ported 78mm FAST and went 11.0 SI with it. As far as HP nums. maybe couldve got a few more HP out of it but wouldve lost a helluva lot of torque down low.
I tried cam2 as well, didnt seem to make much diff. besides burning up the O2's lol
I tried cam2 as well, didnt seem to make much diff. besides burning up the O2's lol
01-27-2011, 04:46 PM
#86
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Haha, well you know you could be right, i had an unported 90 at the time and just never used it. Was afraid it would kill me in low end torque. My philosophy has always been that a good launch meant a good pass was on the way I did manage to get a 1.45 60' out of my worn out 130k ls1 
I did manage to get a 1.45 60' out of my worn out 130k ls1
01-27-2011, 05:09 PM
#87
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Haha, well you know you could be right, i had an unported 90 at the time and just never used it. Was afraid it would kill me in low end torque. My philosophy has always been that a good launch meant a good pass was on the way I did manage to get a 1.45 60' out of my worn out 130k ls1
I did manage to get a 1.45 60' out of my worn out 130k ls1
01-27-2011, 05:12 PM
#88
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https://ls1tech.com/forums/drag-raci...1-74-bump.html
01-27-2011, 05:17 PM
#89
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I always wanted to ask....Since "Stock Internals" include aftermaket intake manifolds are aftermarket cylinder heads accepted too???
01-27-2011, 06:30 PM
#92
Ya, A good description is- Everything that oil touches has to be stock.
On the dyno the SUX2BU sealed up setup makes less power, The sealed ducts with the car not moving restrict the motor, I keep them it. But somthing to remebed. Also they change the AFR on the dyno then the car going down the track. But having the front open on the airbox, or taking the ducts out so the bottem of the filter is open, like the "free ram air", will make more power on the dyno. And having the fans blow right on the filter, you can put a box fan on the ground under the car hitting the bottem of the filter. I've seen some dyno videos of some top power cars and they took the lower airbox off. And just had the lid help up with a block of wood 4inchs off the body. One of the lid clips came off WOT and went in the motor, and tore it up
Look into the stuff the stockers do, there lots of little things you can do. They buy and test many different stock parts, there is a tolerance in them, some are better then others. I haven't checked at stock valve lifts. I'm sure its there but not as much. Not all stock rockers are the same ratio, so they have different valve lifts. The more lift the bigger the difference (more nose scubb). You can get over .020 valve lift between a slightly under the advertised ratio, and a super rocker thats .0x + ratio. This was over .600 lifts.
90* opening of the TB dose not make the most power
when you bolt the headers on, pull them up. Some flanges have larger clearance holes, but the heads will like having the header tube higher.. free hp
Check the fit off the bellow on the TB, and MAFF. My 22* bellow didn't fit that great, And the 85MM maff has a big flange on the back. I cut it back, and its even about a 22* upward cut and fits the turn of the bellow VERY nice, then most people. The top of the flange in not long going into the turn.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y11...IMG_5045-1.jpg
And the way a worm gear hose clamp tightens up, it pulls right around the clamp. You can use that to how the bellow turn fits. Get it smooth inside touching 360* everywhere, most will bunch up and be 1/8 off the turn of the bellow.... free hp.
On the dyno the SUX2BU sealed up setup makes less power, The sealed ducts with the car not moving restrict the motor, I keep them it. But somthing to remebed. Also they change the AFR on the dyno then the car going down the track. But having the front open on the airbox, or taking the ducts out so the bottem of the filter is open, like the "free ram air", will make more power on the dyno. And having the fans blow right on the filter, you can put a box fan on the ground under the car hitting the bottem of the filter. I've seen some dyno videos of some top power cars and they took the lower airbox off. And just had the lid help up with a block of wood 4inchs off the body. One of the lid clips came off WOT and went in the motor, and tore it up
Look into the stuff the stockers do, there lots of little things you can do. They buy and test many different stock parts, there is a tolerance in them, some are better then others. I haven't checked at stock valve lifts. I'm sure its there but not as much. Not all stock rockers are the same ratio, so they have different valve lifts. The more lift the bigger the difference (more nose scubb). You can get over .020 valve lift between a slightly under the advertised ratio, and a super rocker thats .0x + ratio. This was over .600 lifts.
90* opening of the TB dose not make the most power
when you bolt the headers on, pull them up. Some flanges have larger clearance holes, but the heads will like having the header tube higher.. free hp
Check the fit off the bellow on the TB, and MAFF. My 22* bellow didn't fit that great, And the 85MM maff has a big flange on the back. I cut it back, and its even about a 22* upward cut and fits the turn of the bellow VERY nice, then most people. The top of the flange in not long going into the turn.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y11...IMG_5045-1.jpg
And the way a worm gear hose clamp tightens up, it pulls right around the clamp. You can use that to how the bellow turn fits. Get it smooth inside touching 360* everywhere, most will bunch up and be 1/8 off the turn of the bellow.... free hp.
Last edited by studderin; 01-27-2011 at 06:48 PM.
01-27-2011, 07:50 PM
#94
damn, it is so hard to read that...proofread Johnny my head hurts...
Ya, A good description is- Everything that oil touches has to be stock.
On the dyno the SUX2BU sealed up setup makes less power, The sealed ducts with the car not moving restrict the motor, I keep them it. But somthing to remebed. Also they change the AFR on the dyno then the car going down the track. But having the front open on the airbox, or taking the ducts out so the bottem of the filter is open, like the "free ram air", will make more power on the dyno. And having the fans blow right on the filter, you can put a box fan on the ground under the car hitting the bottem of the filter. I've seen some dyno videos of some top power cars and they took the lower airbox off. And just had the lid help up with a block of wood 4inchs off the body. One of the lid clips came off WOT and went in the motor, and tore it up
Look into the stuff the stockers do, there lots of little things you can do. They buy and test many different stock parts, there is a tolerance in them, some are better then others. I haven't checked at stock valve lifts. I'm sure its there but not as much. Not all stock rockers are the same ratio, so they have different valve lifts. The more lift the bigger the difference (more nose scubb). You can get over .020 valve lift between a slightly under the advertised ratio, and a super rocker thats .0x + ratio. This was over .600 lifts.
90* opening of the TB dose not make the most power
when you bolt the headers on, pull them up. Some flanges have larger clearance holes, but the heads will like having the header tube higher.. free hp
Check the fit off the bellow on the TB, and MAFF. My 22* bellow didn't fit that great, And the 85MM maff has a big flange on the back. I cut it back, and its even about a 22* upward cut and fits the turn of the bellow VERY nice, then most people. The top of the flange in not long going into the turn.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y11...IMG_5045-1.jpg
And the way a worm gear hose clamp tightens up, it pulls right around the clamp. You can use that to how the bellow turn fits. Get it smooth inside touching 360* everywhere, most will bunch up and be 1/8 off the turn of the bellow.... free hp.
On the dyno the SUX2BU sealed up setup makes less power, The sealed ducts with the car not moving restrict the motor, I keep them it. But somthing to remebed. Also they change the AFR on the dyno then the car going down the track. But having the front open on the airbox, or taking the ducts out so the bottem of the filter is open, like the "free ram air", will make more power on the dyno. And having the fans blow right on the filter, you can put a box fan on the ground under the car hitting the bottem of the filter. I've seen some dyno videos of some top power cars and they took the lower airbox off. And just had the lid help up with a block of wood 4inchs off the body. One of the lid clips came off WOT and went in the motor, and tore it up
Look into the stuff the stockers do, there lots of little things you can do. They buy and test many different stock parts, there is a tolerance in them, some are better then others. I haven't checked at stock valve lifts. I'm sure its there but not as much. Not all stock rockers are the same ratio, so they have different valve lifts. The more lift the bigger the difference (more nose scubb). You can get over .020 valve lift between a slightly under the advertised ratio, and a super rocker thats .0x + ratio. This was over .600 lifts.
90* opening of the TB dose not make the most power
when you bolt the headers on, pull them up. Some flanges have larger clearance holes, but the heads will like having the header tube higher.. free hp
Check the fit off the bellow on the TB, and MAFF. My 22* bellow didn't fit that great, And the 85MM maff has a big flange on the back. I cut it back, and its even about a 22* upward cut and fits the turn of the bellow VERY nice, then most people. The top of the flange in not long going into the turn.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y11...IMG_5045-1.jpg
And the way a worm gear hose clamp tightens up, it pulls right around the clamp. You can use that to how the bellow turn fits. Get it smooth inside touching 360* everywhere, most will bunch up and be 1/8 off the turn of the bellow.... free hp.
01-27-2011, 07:56 PM
#95
I know a couple people that have added a fast 90 to a SI car and saw exactly the same times at the track, no gain over a ls6 intake...both a4 cars and fully tuned...the intake is not the restriction...
01-28-2011, 11:54 AM
#97
Yup thats good stuff right there, couple questions though...
90* opening of the TB dose not make the most power
And the way a worm gear hose clamp tightens up, it pulls right around the clamp. You can use that to how the bellow turn fits. Get it smooth inside touching 360* everywhere, most will bunch up and be 1/8 off the turn of the bellow.... free hp.
Are you saying not to over tighten it? Or it can cause the bellow to bunch a bit causing turbulance?
01-28-2011, 04:05 PM
#98
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As far as the intake debate, i guess the only way to figure out whether the 90/92 works better over the ls6/78 on an SI motor is to swap all them on the same car, same dyno, and same day. I dont think there would be much measurable diff. tho.
01-28-2011, 08:15 PM
#99
One car wasn't allowed on the list because he switched to 241 heads on a 98 car, which meant he had opened his up.
As these motors get older I'm sure more fixing of old components will be allowed, such as old springs and such, but the rules are very tight in regards to opening up your motor.
As these motors get older I'm sure more fixing of old components will be allowed, such as old springs and such, but the rules are very tight in regards to opening up your motor.
