pglade

Hey guys--I have a question on the 1LE bushings. The GM part number I show is 10164152. My GM parts guys says this is just a generic Camaro bushing. Possibly, he is interpreting his info as "generic" because the bushing is dimensionally the same as regular RCA bushings for that year Camaro.

If I order and recieve this part number, will I, in fact recieve a "harder" or firmer bushing? Has anyone actually put a durometer to these bushings and compared them to others??????? I am getting ready to buy some and just want to make sure I am getting something that is actually firmer than the regular rubber GM or Moog bushings. Thanks very much for the help. Patton Glade Austin, TX

jimmyblue

iTrader: (11)

Which bushing? The LCAs? Those were different, solid
instead of "waffle punched" rubber. But GM has a habit
of "superseding" special parts with generics when the
special ones run out.

Don't know that the rubber hardness is different (could
be, I only looked at the two side by side when I pressed
them out & in) but not having a bunch of holes is bound
to firm them up.

pglade

yes Jimmy--the rear arm bushings (not front suspension) are what I am trying to find info on. Thanks, Patton

Dans2000SS

I'd like to know that part number as well, anyone have it?

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

I keep them here, under a Moog number. If you can't find them, I've got them in stock 90% of the time. $52 for the entire set of 4.

damon_Z

I have the perfect reply for this. Here is an older post of mine that I just copied and pasted. (The original post can be found at https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspension-brakes/423983-my-comparison-between-my-gm-1le-lcas-factory-rear-lcas-pics-inside-questions.html.)

I just had my factory rear control arms replaced with GM's factory 1LE control arms. The 1LE LCAs were purchased new from Dal Slabaugh@ vandevere.com and were part number 10164151. They were priced at $67.32 each and freight was $10.28 for NJ. I had thought of maybe just buying the Moog 1LE-type bushings and using them to replace my factory LCA bushings, but that would probably add more labor time and, in the end, would still cost the same as buying brand-new factory 1LE LCAs. I had wanted to stay with rubber bushings to avoid any binding issues, coldflow, and occasional greasing that are associated with polyurethane bushings; and the possible increase in NVH (noise, vibration, and harshness), graphite greasing, and short lifespan associated with rod-ends. Installation was $65 (including the 1LE panhard rod installation) at TT Performance in Clifton, NJ.

On the 1LE rear control arms bushings, were the following:

HARRIS
B68
62538
FG

1LE LCAs



I inspected the factory rear control arms once they were removed and noticed that the factory bushings had "spacers" unlike the 1LE control arm bushings that were solid. On the factory rear control arm bushings, were the following:

10251393
BLACK
PINK
10251394

factory LCAs



Why would the bushing designs be different? Would one design have an advantage over the other? Thanks in advance for the info.

Just for the hell of it and since the part and installation were inexpensive, I had also purchased an SLP 1LE panhard rod from lmperformance.com. The SLP 1LE panhard rod (SLP part number 70401) was $26.96 and $20 shipping (direct from SLP). The installation was included in the $65 installation. The SLP 1LE panhard rod bushing design was identical to the factory panhard rod bushing design. On the 1LE panhard rod bushing, were the following:

09
CLEVITE SILENTBLOC
FG
62292

1LE panhard rod


There was also an orange marker-slash on the top of the 1LE panhard rod (not pictured).

On one bushing end of the factory panhard rod, were the following:

96
CLEVITE SILENTBLOC
FG
62296

On the other bushing end was the same as above except that 96 and 62296 was, instead, 98 and 62292.

factory panhard rod


Both panhard rods were so identical that I'm not even sure if I got the 1LE panhard rod. All I can do is go by the vendor(s)' product description.

After the installation of the 1LE suspension components, I noticed that there was no increase in NVH. I drive like an old lady so I couldn't tell if my handling improved. Hopefully, the rear 1LE LCAs will improve my 60 foot times this February when Atco Raceway reopens. If not, then I can always use Nitto 555Rs for the rear.

damon_Z

According to my post, the 1LE LCAs were purchased new from Dal Slabaugh@ vandevere.com and were part number 10164151.

Never mind. My part number was for an entire 1LE lower control arm and your part number was just for the 1LE lower control arm bushing.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

You can pay $135 for a pair of 1LE arms... or $52 for the bushings and install them in your stock arms (which are identical). And it takes all of about 5 mintues to do... They press in and out super easily. If you took them someplace to be pressed in, I can't imagine anyone chargine more than $20 to do it (I know I wouldn't, but I'm not a crook).

And considering the installation of the parts in the car consists of 6 bolts, I can't believe anyone would pay $65 to have it done. A set of ramps and 18 and 21mm wrenches (and preferably a torque wrench) is all it takes.

damon_Z

Well, now I know what not do next time, but just believe that I'll pay $65 to have it done. I'm not you.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

Fair enough. But doing brake pads it harder.

pglade

Man!!! Talk about service! I appreciate the detailed pics and discussion....and my question has been pretty much answered. As you guys are well aware a lot of other GM cars have the same SIZE rear LCA bushings (earlier A-bodies, like I have, and GN's etc) and on these other boards they are always recommending THIS bushing when people ask.

After hearing about the "waffle style" one here and viewing the pics I think I have figured it out.

Here's the deal--everyone on these other boards (NON CAMARO/FIREBIRD but GM nonetheless) seems to think this bushing is THE BUSHING TO USE because it is a 1LE bushing and firmer than what they are using (regular Moog or GM, etc solid rubber type bushing also)...at least that is THE IMPRESSION that they are getting. That is why I asked about the actual durometer hardness of the rubber in the bushing. Well, the real story seems to be that yes, it is a firmer bushing, BUT ONLY COMPARED TO THE REGULAR CAMARO "WAFFLED" BUSHING. The people on these other boards aren't aware of this comparison. These old a-bodies came with SOLID RUBBER BUSHINGS to start with and my money says a durometer test of a Moog replacement for, say a 70 Olds 442 rear LCA bushing, would be the same as this GM 1LE bushing.

You guys have probably already discussed this but I assume GM used the waffle bushing to reduce NVH which was a growing problem as they progressed through each year of a particular Camaro generation and the tooling, etc tolerances in the body got looser and looser. I'll bet the waffle style was a "band aid" cost saving solution GM used as that generation Camaro aged. I do remember reading an article back in the 80's or so in Car & Driver or MT where they were testing that years Camaro and they made the comment about how the vehicle weight had increased. When they asked GM the answer they got was most of the weight increase was due to increased use of sealants, glues, sound deadeners due to the aging of that particular generation of Camaro. So, this waffle design makes sense in that situation. Then---when they intro'd the 1LE option they figured those buyers weren't too worried about NVH so they went with a solid rubber bushing.

Thus was born the urban legend of the 1LE bushing....firmer, yes --but only when compared to the waffled one.

I ordered one yesterday and I will try to locate a durometer and do some comparisons on a solid 1LE GM bushing (assuming that is what comes in vs a waffled one) vs a regular Moog older a-body part number.

This has been extremely helpful---I got on this "campaign" because it is always cool to find these better GM parts and use them vs regular Moog (still great stuff) or regular GM stuff but in this case (for mere older a-body owners like me) I don't think the end result is what I was hoping for.

I'll be back as I find more and once again, thanks for the detailed pics and replies. Patton Glade Austin, TX

Edit: on the board I am usually on (RealOldsPower.com--- sorry--don't do this to an Olds guy!) one respondent does mention he and his buds did a "thumb durometer" test on the 1LE vs regular a-body Moogs and the 1LEs seemed definitely firmer or harder---I hope they are). Be back.

Sam Strano

iTrader: (41)

The Moog bushings are the very same as 1LE. Same Harris bushings and casting numbers..... Why pay more at the dealer?

And the 1LE bushings are very densely packed, they are quite firm. But being rubber still have some flex so they don't bind when moved on two planes like urethane. And they don't wind up because they don't have the void area like the stock bushings do.

BJM

iTrader: (1)

I jumped on the 1LE bandwagon for my 1987 GN. The 1LE bushings were in fact much firmer than the factory solid bushing and very obviously so. However I also bought some new Moog bushings and they did seem identical to the 1LE bushing. It seems you just can't buy the old mushy bushings now.